No1Mustang
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324th BS A/C Codes
Hello everyone, 1st post on this site, lots of awesome information to be reading but for now I have a question, I'm doing a living history impression - of a waist gunner on a B17F that served from Bassingbourn in 1942/3, I have a tail number sorted out and my own peice of nose art but haven't managed to figure out the AC Code as in DF-A, B,C etc, I'm basing my impression on a made up crew so I don't do any injustices to any particular crew/ members or their relatives. Does anyone know If any particular letters were not used in the 324th? Any Help is greatfully appreciated
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tailgunnerson
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What tail number are you going to use? I may be able to help. Do you have a plan for a name or anything else?
tailgunnerson "Please remember those who gave so much for the freedom we enjoy this day."
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jpeters140
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Karl...If I am not mistaken...The DF was the designator for the 324th BS...and the A,B,C etc represents the first, second, and third aircraft assigned to the squadron and continues as each additional aircraft was assigned......If, say for instance, the C, or third original aircraft was lost, then the replacement aircraft would also carrry the same code C as the original aircraft.... However, there would be only ONE of the suffix codes used at any single time period..this is to say that there would only be ONE C at any single period of time...however, there could be as many as three or more total...all with the C code, if there were three aircraft lost, with all three carrying the same C, as replacement aircraft were asssigned to replace each lost aircraft. I do not know how many aircraft were actually assigned to the 324th, but as a WAG, I would say it would be in the vicinity of some 15-17 aircraft...the 17th aircraft would be alphabetically Q....so, any letter following AFTER Q would be appropriate, such as R,T,U,V,W, X,Y,or Z. If this was the selection, that was used to designate the sequence of progression for the letter following the DF- Jim :-)
James S. Peters Sr. T/Sgt B-17 Flt Engr, 27 missions 99 BG, 348BS, 5th Wing, 15th AAF Tortorella, (Foggia#2), Italy My Tour was from 12/03/44-06/19/45 M/Sgt USAF (Retired)
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No1Mustang
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Hi Tailgunnerson, I spent a good few hours last night googling and going through a B17 serial # website and found that they didn't use # 41-24986, I have a name and a piece of nose art I designed which hopefully I can upload onto here, Hi Jim, I went through 91st websites / pictures and books last night and it looks like your right with the letters, I wrote out the Alphabet and crossed the letters off as I saw them and those that are left are R,T,U,V,W,X,Y + Z. I will do one more search just to see if I have missed any but after hours of looking it looks good :)
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RSwank
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No1Mustang
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Hi RSwank, Thats a few more crossed off of my list, I think the best bet I've got is to find photo's of Kingman Arizona from after the war and finding a 324th B17 that went to Bomber Heaven from the scrap man, at least then I know the bomber made it back home. :D
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shooshoobaby
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D , A Few Examples - B-17 # 42 - 29837 DF A " Lady Luck " 324th Sq. 7/27/45 RFC Stillwater , OK. B-17 # 42 - 97959 DF Y " Rhapsody In Red " 324th Sq. 11/28/45 RFC Kingman , AZ. B-17 # 43 - 38889 DF M " Chippewa The Miwaukee Road " 324th Sq. 11/19/45 RFC Kingman , AZ. Mike
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No1Mustang
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Hi Mike, Thanks for that, all the pictures I found don't clearly show the markings, just thousands of B17's lined up, such a shame there we'rent more saved. I think DF-Y will be my choice, when me and my friend went to Bassingbourn last month we stood in her old hardstand :) amongst others, Thanks Mike
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lwi2858
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The codes changed over time also. Miss Minookie (43-30712) was OR-O and OR-R. Some of the planes were switched squadrons Just Plain Lonesome (42-39975) was DF-Z and later to the 323rd, but don't have her code OR-?. Ray Bowden has Great Speckled Bird 41-24527 as DF-Y. DF-A was the Memphis Belle, Lady Luck took her place. Also has Local Girl (42-3111) and Little Jean (42-31230) as DF-A1. DF-E was Quitchurbitchin, one of the longest serving ships. I don't see any other letter/number codes other than A1, so with a slight stretch maybe DF-Y2 or something. Good luck! L
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No1Mustang
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Thanks for the info, Do you happen to know why Quitchurbitchin was DF-A1 as opposed to a single letter? As there was DF-A1 there is nothing to say that the rest of the codes would'nt have followed suit if the war had carried on longer. Thanks again
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lwi2858
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I don't know why there was a DF-A1. My uncle flew with the Klotz crew and was KIA in Mary Kay DF-K.Their first ship was 505 Quitchurbitchin, which had been one of the first ships assigned to 324. 505 had been badly damaged in combat, and was a hanger queen for almost a year. She was returned to active duty in DEC 1943, but suffered from a bunch of aborts and was officially retired in April 1944. Their home ship was Liberty Belle DF-M. Each squadron in England had a 2 letter code, and a radio call sign, so 324 was DF or Dimple. Each ship had a call sign letter so 505 was Dimple E for Easy. As a WAG , maybe since 505 and perhaps other forts were hanger queens, if they were assigned more than 26 aircraft, obviously there would not be enough letters. Doing a quick scan of Ray Bowden, I do not see any I's, possibly not used , so maybe it was 25 a/c. I see a 401st A1 and a 323rd B1. Little Jean DF-A1 was lost on Jan 11, 1944, called the "greatest air battle in history" at the time. Pilot was Lt. Uskela, who's crew were barracks mates to the Klotz crew. The more research you do, the more you find that the fighting the war was the important thing, and the other stuff was filled in, sometimes later. Records are often hand written or on triplicate carbon copies, and difficult to read, some illegible. Take your best guess and go with it.It may not be possible to be entirely exact, and even then you would be exact for a certain time period only. Good Luck, Lou
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No1Mustang
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Hi Lou, wow that's a huge amount of useful information, I think I'll go with choosing a letter followed by a 1, Its the one thing I love about living history, its not just about knowing the basic information but the small details. I find these details are the best as people take you more seriously when you discuss all the small things aswell as the big. Thanks again Lou. Are you based in England? I'm hoping to create some kind of USAAF display for one of the military shows next year as they are few and far between and I feel they need to be represented a bit more. :D
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lwi2858
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No, not based in England, New Jersey, USA!!!! This board is a great resource. I've "met" many of the children of John's former crew, and some of the Mary Kay's crew. I have learned a lot, and "guessed" some more. I've gotten some of the diaries crew members kept, and it is interesting to see the view from 70 years ago. Young guys talking about going to the movies on Saturday night. As the men who were there are passing , more and more details are being lost, it is a shame. Thank you for keeping the memory of the USAAF alive. One of my neighbor's father was a wing commander in the RAF. We found a shop in England which was selling replicas of his prewar aircraft, 37 squadron if I remember. He led heavy bombers in WWII. Drop me a pm if you like lwi2858 (at) gmail.com. replace at with @. Ray Bowden's book is full of information. Lou l
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No1Mustang
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I'm in Jersey!! well, The Original Jersey, across the pond :D If we don't keep the memories alive for future generations they will never know of the sacrifices made by the men and women during WW2. My Wife's Grandad served as a radio mechanic during WW2 with 165 squadron, he remembers seeing Lancasters, B17's, B24's whilst based on his Spitfire base, he has some great stories and pictures. Karl
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lwi2858
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Too funny! I named my sailboat "Jersey Lily" ! My daughter Elizabeth, is an avid sailor, and wanted me to name the boat after her. When she was younger we called her Lil, or Lily, so I suggested Lillia, which is Italian for Lily. One day we were drinking some claret from Lily Langtree's California estate (Guenoc) and I jokingly said we should make it the only wine we serve on the boat. My wife asked why, and I said that Lily Langtree was known as the Jersey Lily. Both wife and daughter insisted that the boat be Christened Jersey Lily, so there you are! It turns out that there was a steam passenger launch on the Shrewsbury River (New Jersey) in the 1880-90's, so I feel justified. I just got a blue print from the Herreshoff museum of the original Jersey Lily, which I will have framed! Let me know if there is anything I can do to help your research! lou
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No1Mustang
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It sure is a small world we live in! Lily Langtree is buried in one of our parish church graveyards and it is always full of visitors. Thanks for your help Lou, I will keep you posted on my project, I posted a few photos in the B17 Survivor album under Sally B @ Duxford folder, check them out and see what we got up to in May this year, :D I also have some of Bassingbourn to put up to when I get around to it. Have a great weekend and thanks again :D Karl
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