Information on this plane

Discussion in 'Heavy & Very Heavy Bombers' started by Rick Thompson, Aug 17, 2017.

  1. Rick Thompson

    Rick Thompson New Member

    Hello all. I am new to this site. I received this picture from a good friend to place in my study. I was hoping to find information on this exact plane; it's missions, crew, and if it was still operational. Any help you can give me will be much appreciated. Thanks. rick@tridentairgroup.com
    B-24.jpg
     
  2. James Mcadory

    James Mcadory New Member

    A quick search on B24BestWeb has this entry "(41)-27378 (MSN 1223) remanufactured by Beech as C-45G 51-11686 in 1952". Hopefully someone else will have more.
     
  3. James Mcadory

    James Mcadory New Member

    After more looking this appears to be a converted AT-11/C45 rather than a B-24.
     
  4. pathfinder504

    pathfinder504 Active Member

    42-7378

    42-7230/7464 Ford B-24E-25-FO Liberator

    No specific a/c data on this plane in Baugher.
     
  5. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    Concur with Dave, citing links here as an aid.
    Joe Baugher http://www.joebaugher.com/usaf_serials/1942_1.html B-24E-25-FO-42-7378 service history not specifically recorded by Baugher in serial grouping 42-7230/7464

    By the LARGE number 11 on her nose in this photo this liberator may have been a ZI (United States) training aircraft. Appears to be an early "E" model, note the national insignia "star with no bars".
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2017
  6. pathfinder504

    pathfinder504 Active Member

    Saw a few sites that noted that most B-24E (Fords) were retained in the US at training facilities in the SW US. So Kingman's theory has more than a 50/50 probability.

    The star w/o meatball was regulation from 6 May 1942 to 28 June 1943.
     
    25Kingman49 likes this.
  7. RSwank

    RSwank Well-Known Member

    Same plane appears on BestWeb here:

    http://www.b24bestweb.com/378-v3.htm

    It is not the same photo but may have been taken at the same time. There is a date of 22 July 43 listed.
     
    25Kingman49 likes this.
  8. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    Sorry to go wiki...here is the chronology of U.S. aircraft national insignia markings, related to Dave's post #6

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_military_aircraft_national_insignia

    Well, now Danial Stockton has a better image of 42-7378 to add to the BBW collection. Maybe Dave Gansz or other members with B-24, ZI training base location knowledge can identify where this Lib served.
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2017
  9. Rick Thompson

    Rick Thompson New Member

    Thanks for all the help. I too looked through the registry and did not see it specifically listed. Not sure if that is good news or not. I will keep plugging away to see what I can find.
     
  10. Rick Thompson

    Rick Thompson New Member

    I went through his site quite thoroughly. I did not see this tail number listed anywhere. I saw many planes close to this registration were sold to Paul Mantz during that time, but this one was not listed.
     
  11. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    Rick,
    You could, if you wish request the Individual Aircraft Record Card (IARC) for B-24E-25-FO-42-7378 from AFHRA, Maxwell, AFB. The email address for requests to AFHRA is

    AFHRA.NEWS@us.af.mil

    Which is provided on the main AFHRA page here under announcements:

    http://www.afhra.af.mil/
     
  12. pathfinder504

    pathfinder504 Active Member

    FWIW I went through USN assignments of B-24 model a/c .--which retained their AAF Mfg S/N for chain of custody before they became PB4Ys---no Ford build 24's in our production block went Navy.
     
  13. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    Joe Baugher discusses the "E" model, 801 built, see:

    http://www.joebaugher.com/usaf_bombers/b24_13.html

    The Ford built [FO] population is rather small with only 490 built at Willow Run.

    The TB designation offered on the BestWeb [BBW] page (post #7) (if correct) also suggests this was a training ship. Interesting Danial's "Contributor" could not also offer an assignment for this aircraft.
     
  14. Rick Thompson

    Rick Thompson New Member

    I have sent a request in to the email provided. Will let you know if I hear back. Thanks again.
     
  15. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    Good news, Rick.
    You should receive a confirmation email acknowledging your request in a few days. These IARC's are normally only one or two pages, but sometimes can be difficult to interpret, acronym & code heavy. Please scan and post it here once in your possession. Members here can help de-code this document.
     
  16. Rick Thompson

    Rick Thompson New Member

  17. Rick Thompson

    Rick Thompson New Member

    I got this response:

    B-24E, s/n 42-7378

    Manufactured by Ford Motor Co., Willow Run MI and received by the USAAF on 15 Jun 1943.

    Jun 1943 To 2525th AAF Base Unit ([Pilot School, Specialized Four Engine], Air Training Command), Liberal AAF KS (deployments to Dugway Proving Ground UT and Newark AAF NJ)

    Jun 1945 To Ontario AAF CA and disposed as salvage
     
  18. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    Rick,
    Did AFHRA only send you this annotated account as you provided here or did they also send a copy of the actual IARC? If AFHRA sent a copy of the card would you please scan it and attach a copy here.

    The timeline if there is one here appears a little off. The 2525 AAF Base Unit, Liberal Army Air Field, KS did not come into existence until 1 May 1944 to 1 November 1945. Maybe not, it seems the intention was the first listing below, which would become the 2525AAF Base Unit after May 1944.

    From: AAF AND ATTACHED UNITS BY STATION IN CONTINENTAL U. S FROM 1 SEP 1939 TO 2 SEP 1945
    Liberal Army Air Field, KS
    AAF Advanced Flying Training School/AAF Pilot School, Adv 2 Eng/AAF Flying School (Spl 4 Eng) Mar 43-1 Nov 45

    60 Two Engine Flying Training Sq Apr 43-30 Apr 44
    63 Two Engine Flying Training Sq 17 Jun 43-30 Apr 44
    396 Aviation Sq 20 Apr 43-30 Apr 44
    527 Base Headquarters & Air Base Sq 20 Apr 43-30 Apr 44
    1029 Basic Flying Training Sq 12 Mar 43-30 Apr 44
    1030 Basic Flying Training Sq 13 May 43-30 Apr 44
    1278 Guard Sq 29 Apr 43-30 Apr 44
    324 Sub Depot 15 Apr 43-30 Apr 44
    444 AAF Band/744 Army Band/744 AAF Band 20 Apr 43-30 Sep 45
    1024 Quartermaster Pltn, Transportation (Air Base) 20 Apr 43-30 Apr 44
    539 Service Sq 15 Mar 44-1 Apr 44
    2525 AAF Base Unit 1 May 44-1 Nov 45

    Anyway seems this ship spent most of its service life at Liberty AAFld
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberal_Army_Air_Field

    Could request more history from AFHRA about Liberty Field (which appears to include photo records)
    http://airforcehistoryindex.org/search.php?q=Liberal+Army+&c=u&h=100&F=1/1/1940&L=
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2017
  19. Rick Thompson

    Rick Thompson New Member

    This is all I received:

    Dear Mr. Thompson


    Thank you for your request.


    Attached are the interpreted assignments for the B-24E, s/n 42-7378.


    I hope this information is helpful.


    Sincerely

    ARCHANGELO 'Archie' DiFANTE

    AFHRA/RSR

    600 Chennault Circle

    Maxwell AFB AL 36112-6424

    (334) 953-2447

    DSN 493-2447



    The attachment had this:

    B-24E, s/n 42-7378

    Manufactured by Ford Motor Co., Willow Run MI and received by the USAAF on 15 Jun 1943.

    Jun 1943 To 2525th AAF Base Unit ([Pilot School, Specialized Four Engine], Air Training Command), Liberal AAF KS (deployments to Dugway Proving Ground UT and Newark AAF NJ)

    Jun 1945 To Ontario AAF CA and disposed as salvage
     
  20. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    Well, Archie is one of the most senor and seasoned archivists at AFHRA. Perhaps he though there was so little information on the card that this interpreted account was sufficient. I am still a little surprised he did not include a copy of the card.
     

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