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groundcrew KIA

Discussion in '362nd FG' started by Airwar, Dec 10, 2015.

  1. Airwar

    Airwar Well-Known Member

    T/Sgt. Arthur L.Hartman,KIA 28 July 1944,reason unknown.
    Buried in the US Cemetery La Cambe near Isigny Plot AE-5-97.Reinterred in Normandy Cemetery.
    362 FG/ 379 FS
    Probably Dave knows more.

    Jaap
     
  2. RSwank

    RSwank Well-Known Member

    He was killed by a shell while working on a P-47.

    https://obscureco.wordpress.com/tag/arthur-hartman/


    "Although the fighting gradually moved away from the field, shelling remained a problem. The Germans dropped a few token shells in when the P-47s were taking off and again when they returned from missions. On July 27, T/Sgt. Arthur Hartmann was killed when the P-47 he was working on was hit by a shell; PFC John Goodall, a medic with the 377th, was also killed by shellfire."

    Another version of the incident says Hartman was in a shallow foxhole when he was killed.
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2017
  3. Airwar

    Airwar Well-Known Member

    Thank you Rolland.

    Jaap
     
  4. pouard

    pouard New Member

    Hello, my name is Christophe Pouard. I am part of an association: the flowers of memory ... I sponsor the grave of a soldier who died in Normandy; He was named Arthur Hartman he was originally from Illinois and his rank was T / SG. Every year I will flower his grave several times! Do you have any information to send me? I would like to know if there are still people of his family alive; Children, brother, sister ??? I will be able to send them photos of his tomb every time I flourished ... here in Normandy, we do not forget the sacrifice that these brave soldiers have made for us ...... hoping to have News on this forum merci !!! Christophe
     
  5. RSwank

    RSwank Well-Known Member

    Arthur was born on 3 Nov 1913 in East Orange New Jersey to Charles Joseph Dvorak and Dorothy (Dora) (Webb) Dvorak.
    By 1920 the family was living in Chicago, Cook County, IL. He had a sister Catherine E (Pege) Dvorak (1915-1997) and a brother Charles Edwin (Chick) Dvorak.(1916-1967)
    By 1940 Dora had married Frank Hartman. (I am not sure yet when that happened. She divorced Charles around 1925). Arthur took on his step father's last name Hartman as did Catherine.
    Arthur joined the army 20 May 1942. He apparently was married to Pearl M (Koenig) Hartman.

    This information comes from a family tree posted on ancestry.com.

    There is also a photo of him on the ancestry.com thread, not sure yet if I can re-post it here.
    I will try and contact the person who posted the family tree on ancestry.com.

    Update:
    Grave of brother: https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=25997121
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2017
  6. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    Rolland, it appears to me that the photo of Arthur L Dvorak (Hartman) available on Ancestry.com is "Public". If not, photos from contributors are normally marked private and hidden from view.

    Arthur L Hartman, enlistment 20 May 1942, ASN: 36340443 https://aad.archives.gov/aad/record...tf=F&q=36340443&bc=sl&rpp=10&pg=1&rid=6510101
    Rather empty findagrave page https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=56645395
    ABMC record https://www.abmc.gov/node/409463#.WTa6_uSGOM8
    Headstone/Interment Record
    Arthur L Hartman, Headstone-Interment.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2017
  7. Airwar

    Airwar Well-Known Member

    Two articles about Arthur Hartman
     

    Attached Files:

    25Kingman49 likes this.
  8. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    Jaap,
    Looks like the memorial once located at the southwest corner of S Kedvale Ave & W 15th St, Chicago, IL 60623 did not stand the test of time.
    S Kedvale Ave & W 15th St, Chicago, IL 60623.jpg
     
    Airwar likes this.
  9. Airwar

    Airwar Well-Known Member

    Scott your right. It seems that they just remove the plaquette. We can send the Townhall an quistion what happens with the plaque.
     
  10. Airwar

    Airwar Well-Known Member

    25Kingman49 likes this.
  11. pouard

    pouard New Member

    [​IMG]
     
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  12. pouard

    pouard New Member

    Here is the tomb of the hero Arthur Hartman. My wife, my daughter and I are always very proud to go to flower his sepulture. I hope one day to be able to speak with a member of his family and why not take him to his grave so that she can get caught[​IMG]
     
    25Kingman49 likes this.
  13. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    Merci beaucoup Christophe pour votre famille aide à prendre soin de la tombe de TSgt Hartman. [Thank you very much Christophe for your family help caring for the grave of T/Sgt Hartman]

    As noted earlier I believe the photo of Arthur L Dvorak (Hartman) available on ancestry.com is in the public domain. If need be cite Lenore Browning who posted the photo and brief bio for Arthur L Dvorak (Hartman) on the Ancestry.com site.

    Sadly Arthur L Hartman is not in uniform in this picture, hopefully a photo of him in uniform will turn up at some later point in time. This photo could use some restoration, perhaps a forum member with some "Photoshop" skills can improve this image.
    Arthur L Dvorak (Hartman).jpg

    Scott
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jun 6, 2017
    Airwar and pouard like this.
  14. pouard

    pouard New Member

    Thank you all for the valuable information about Arthur
     
  15. pouard

    pouard New Member

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]The wall of the disappeared - Omaha beach - the Colleville sur Mer cemetery overlooking the beach and other pictures of Arthur's grave
     
    25Kingman49 likes this.
  16. RSwank

    RSwank Well-Known Member

    Last edited: Jun 6, 2017
    25Kingman49, pouard and Airwar like this.
  17. pouard

    pouard New Member

    Oh thousand thank you, I will try to find nephews or nieces and it will be thanks to you: you are extraordinary, here in france it is very difficult to find information; thanks again
     
  18. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    I hope what follows is on topic although extraneous content. I prefer to visualize these locations via maps to better understand where these events occurred. Using Jaap's link https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_qjJbH2gOxVSzVQdjQtMFRJWlk/edit the following 362FG ground echelon movements from the UK to France were plotted. This also represents about the last 11 days of T/Sgt Arthur L Hartman's life cut short at the age of 30. The UK/France overview map gets a little messy so is complemented with UK and France pages.

    The movement of the 362FG from the UK to the continent was sluggish to say the least (but there was an invasion on, the fate of which was not certain).
    Overview for what it is worth.
    [1] Overview 362FG movement UK to France.jpg

    UK segment of the above map, approximate movement times and dates are included. Interesting tidbit here http://www.ddaymuseum.co.uk/d-dayon...alling-area-camps-c6-c7-c8-and-c9-hiltingbury
    [2] Later days of TSgt Hartman in the UK.jpg

    Channel crossing was provided by the Royal Navy aboard S.S./H.M.T. Neuralia a relic built in 1912 before the "Great War" but at least she kept their feet dry, source http://www.britisharmedforces.org/pages/nat_troopships.htm
    [3] S.S.-H.M.T. Neuralia.jpg

    Off Omaha Beach the 362FG ground echelon was transferred from HMT Neuralia to unknown or numbered LST's (Landing Ship Tank) similar to these
    [4] LST Landing Ship Tank.jpg
    Overview of landing in France and movement to A-12 -Lignerolles Airfield (ALG A-12) 49.175556, -0.790000. Unclear where camp 4 was located other than about a mile inland from Omaha Beach. A-12 was located about 14 miles/22.29 km southeast of Omaha Beach
    [5] Later days of TSgt Hartman in France, and beyond.jpg

    Obviously a fluid battle front from 06 June to 01 August 1944 depicted below. Perhaps why T/Sgt Hartman was initially interned at the Cemetery La Cambe where Allied and Nazi troops were initially interred. C'est la vie, 5 days after setting foot on French soil T/Sgt Hartman was KIA battling for the freedom of the world. The map below shows a tiny spot in Normandy where the tides of war would shift, and the Nazi defeat was inevitable.
    [6] 01 Aug 1944 GerWW2BattlefrontAtlas.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2017

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