B-17 found in germany, do you know the pilots name?

Discussion in 'Heavy & Very Heavy Bombers' started by chris1, Sep 4, 2016.

  1. chris1

    chris1 Active Member

    @rolland,
    this is an interesting time calculation.

    i also suspect so.

    post #121 is, what edgar kranz told me. the plane was very low. he says the pilot must have seen the children with their sleighs.


    one report gives "afternoon" as the time of capture. Could you fit this into the time calculation?
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2016
  2. RSwank

    RSwank Well-Known Member

    Yes, some men were captured in the afternoon. I don't think any of them "evaded" in any sense. From Hansmann's account it appears that they may have lay hidden in the snow for a while but a I don't think any of them would have been able to move very far from where they landed. The area seems to be all open snow covered fields and all of them were wearing dark flight gear. "Maybe" they used cut up parts of the parachute canopies as camouflage but they would not have had much time to do that. The "search" started almost as soon as they landed. However, the fact that Rambo apparently was able to make it to Marianhof before being captured suggests that either the seachers were looking in the wrong places or there was some "cover" that allowed the men to move more than we think. I suppose it is possible that the boys in the village misjudged the distances out to the parachutists and the search was started some distance away from where they actually landed. I don't know.

    Perhaps we will yet get an account from one of the crew relatives about the captures. We will see.
     
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2016
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  3. chris1

    chris1 Active Member

    the crew did not evade, because all of them were captured the same day. the search party with hansmann did not find them at that day. so i think they were captured by another or two other search parties. hansmann said, they found round circles in the snow. i suspect, other people watched the parachutes and sent search party too.
     
  4. chris1

    chris1 Active Member

    Schutterwald crashsite
    pictures 24.09.2016

    1 Eugen Hansmann and Edgar Kranz
    2 Eugen Hansmann
    3 Tieflachkanal
    4-9 crashsite (you can see less trees at the site, than in the forrest arround)

    eugen und edgar 1.jpg eugen.jpg schutterwald crashsite 1.jpg schutterwald crashsite 2.jpg schutterwald crashsite 3.jpg wald 2.jpg waldboden.jpg baumstamm.jpg wald 1.jpg
     
  5. chris1

    chris1 Active Member

    Edge of the wood (forrest)
    pictures 24.09.2016

    1 view from müllen direction to east
    2 view to north east
    3 view to south
    4 view to north

    view from muellen direction 1.jpg view to northeast.jpg view to south.jpg view to north.jpg
     
  6. MBP_History

    MBP_History New Member

    Hello, I am the grandson of James S Pillsbury. I am also the historian of the family so this thread interests me very much. Unfortunately I was never able to meet my grandfather. I have to go to bed now but I'm going to browse the photos briefly and try to find him. My father may not join the forum but he did say he was going to send an email reply to the letter he received. He should know more than I do, and I'm sure he'd like to learn more about this as well. My sister lives in Germany near Cologne. I'm definitely going to have to check out the crash site next time I get a chance to visit her. Thank you all for putting this thread together.
     
  7. MBP_History

    MBP_History New Member

    Almost certainly Pillsbury on the top right of the bottom picture. Looks just like my dad. Awesome thread. Thanks everyone who contributed. I'll check it out more tomorrow and try to find any extra information I can add.
     
  8. Airwar

    Airwar Well-Known Member

    MBP welcome to this forum.

    Jaap
     
  9. chris1

    chris1 Active Member

    MBP, very pleasing to read from you here in the forum,
    many thanks to you and to your father.

    a window to history opens, thank to the forum
     
  10. MBP_History

    MBP_History New Member

    Thank you all for the warm welcome. Where might I find more information about my grandfather's service? I'm not sure where I got this idea, but he may have been shot down/bailed out prior to this incident. Very interested to know if that's true or just something my imagination came up with as a child.
     
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  11. RSwank

    RSwank Well-Known Member

    MBP, I just sent you a PM (conversation) regarding more info.
     
  12. Airwar

    Airwar Well-Known Member

    Do you have his Missing Air Crew Report - MACR ?
    If not,send me an PM with your email.

    Jaap
     
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  13. Linda

    Linda New Member

    What is your sourc
     
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  14. chris1

    chris1 Active Member

    dear linda,
    eugen hansman was a child at the age of 13 years at that time. he told me about. his father, who met your father, told eugen on the same day when it happend. eugen hansmann also wrote about in chapter 17 of his book.

    if you would like to ask eugen about, he will gladly answer/reply.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2016
  15. RSwank

    RSwank Well-Known Member

    I have made contact with a relative of John T McErlane. Perhaps we will learn more over the next few days.
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2016
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  16. chris1

    chris1 Active Member

    please be cautious, the chapter is heavy.
     
  17. Airwar

    Airwar Well-Known Member

    Good search Rolland. I know its easyer research in your own country,to find the right ways.
    I think with Chris,Linda and MBP you will finished this case.

    Jaap
     
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  18. RSwank

    RSwank Well-Known Member

    I just wrote a letter to a relative of Hunter Hart Dunn, so at this point we have tried to contact relatives of the entire crew. So far, 4 of the 9 families have responded. If we can get 1/2 to 2/3 of them to reply I consider it a success. For the men who came home, some of them suffered with PTSD (undiagnosed) which affected them the rest of their lives. For families who suffered a loss, the wounds sometimes never healed. While WW2 ended 71 years ago the effects on families sometimes never ended.
     
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  19. James S. Pillsbury

    James S. Pillsbury New Member

    I am Pillsbury's son and the crew member on the upper right is definitely my father, James Pillsbury.
     
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  20. 25Kingman49

    25Kingman49 Well-Known Member

    McErlane-Crew.jpg
    Standing (L-R): Capt. John T. McErlane, Pilot; 2nd Lt. Earl H. Hansen Co-Pilot; 1st Lt. Paul J. Manouvier, Bombardier; 2nd Lt. James S. Pillsbury, Navigator.
    Kneeling (L-R): S/Sgt. J. Lorin Pence, Engineer TTG; S/Sgt. Robert E. Dennard, TG; T/Sgt. William E Rambo, Jr. Radio Op.; S/Sgt. Michael A. Roppolo, Jr. BTG; S/Sgt. Hunter H. Dunn. WG.
     
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