Whoops...went on twice!

Tom...Here's a snapshot of a P47 your grandfather flew. His buddy Fred Smith says it had a lot of bomb tags on the cowl. Fred says he and Barney often flew the same plane at different intervals.  Mike

[image]local://upfiles/13540/1C61E27540104A4695F57FDB55FB8F84.jpg[/image]

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Hi there Mike,
Is there any name painted on the fuselage behind the 347th insignia?  Fred's assigned P-47 was "The Virgin", coded 7A6, s/n 42-28339.   Sadly 1st Lt. John E. Powers was killed flying a mission in this plane on 27 Feb 1945.  Was a very experienced pilot.  Hugh Dow was shot down in 7A8 "Lillian" 42-28574 on 22 Feb 1945 and became a POW.  Guess we've strayed off topic from P-39s.   Thanks for posting more pictures of your father in the photo gallery.
Best to you and Tom,
Bob
 
(Correction to original post: date of Hugh Dow's shoot down should be 22 Jan 1945)
Bob

[image]local://upfiles/5932/4831BAC905FA4F6CA93D2E81EC310EB0.jpg[/image]

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Thanks, Bob...yes I knew Fred flew the Virgin...did'nt see it on this plane though. I wish my dad had some larger pics taken, but I guess not a lot of photos were alowed to be taken. I had only about 10-12 small snapshots he had in his photo collection. Will post more on the Tom's 347th photo gallery. Regards, Mike

Bob...It was noted Hugh Dow shot down on January, 1945 in the 350th book, is this wrong date? I scanned this pilot log of Barney's and it was interesting the Jan. 22, 1945 notation at top right.."Dive Bombed Brenner... Then my dad makes a (Dow) at the end. Any more history on this mission?  Thanks, Mike
 
click the link
http://www.geocities.com/mike99216/Dow.jpg

Hey Mike,

Scan those small pics at a high resolution and you will have some good sized pictures. I've done it with a lot of my grandfather's.

14th AAF 23rd FG 118th TRS

Hi Mike,
 
My mistake, the book and your dad's logbook entry are right, of course.   Jan 22, 1945 was the day Hugh Dow was shot down over Thiene airfield.  His plane was hit in the turbo supercharger as he was climbing away from the field and immediately caught fire.  This severed the elevator control rod at around 8,000 ft which suddenly put him in an uncontrolled dive.  Almost didn't get out.  
 
Dow's personal account and the story of his return back to the crash site in November of 2000 are posted on an excellent website by Italian aviation historian Giuseppe Versolato:
 
http://www.giuseppeversolato.it/News/index.asp
 
Story told in six parts with text in English and Italian, plus lots of interesting photos.  Great stuff.
 
Cheers,
Bob

What a great site, Bob -- and yet another that I never found while searching.  There's a few Italian sites I've found regarding P-47's.  Must be something about them flying over the treetops for a few years that makes an indelible impression.  Here's a quote from Major Dow about what transpired after he hit the ground (from http://warwingsart.com/350thFG/P47/347thFS/index.htm):
 
I bailed out at 2.000 ft, landing amidst a light explosion of flak and spraining my knee slipping on the powdery snow. About 30 minutes passed between the time my feet touched the snow and my capture.

I was, of course, afraid of capture and other than stopping for a moment to pick up a fragment of my aircraft's skin from the smoking hole in the ground, I did not stop again for anything frivolous. I could hear the Krauts from the airfield yelling to each other, within a very few minutes, as they ran towards the area where I had descended to the ground.

Naturally, I ran in the opposite direction. It was shortly afterward that I ran up to the fence that separated the path from a farmhouse. It was 25 to 50 meters from the fence. I called out something to the effect : "Can you help me"? at which point the door opened and a man stepped out on the porch. He looked at me for a few moments--gave no indication of his intention--and then went back into the house for a moment. It was at this point that both he and his son appeared in the doorway and he sent the boy out to the lane where I was standing.

I believe the young boy motioned for me to follow him and we then both began running down the path, with him in the lead. After two or three minutes of this the young lad suddenly stopped and turned around, obviously afraid. I don't recall that either of us said anything, but he then began running back from where we had come. I don't know whether it was at this point, or a few meters further down the path, (a wide walk way with fences on each side, obviously used by all the locals) that I saw what I took to be a small village maybe half a kilometer ahead. I had to make a decision. Continue into the village or look for some other place to hide.

From the shouts in the background I knew that I did not have much time. Naturally, I have always wondered whether I might have found a 'savior' had I proceeded on down that path to the village. But I was afraid that I would run into either an Italian police officer or a fascist sympathizer.

But that's the whole story; the man and his son were the only two humans I encountered between my arrival on the ground and my capture by German troops some 30 to 45 minutes later. I had hidden under some corn stalks for at least half of that time and had heard soldiers walk by and saw a German Officer on horseback ride by. He was up high enough to see my steps in the snow across the field and soon afterward I was surrounded and ordered-- 'OUST'..."

Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

This may be common knowledge, but I found a couple links regarding the final outcome of the P-39's and airmen of the 350th that landed in Portugal en route to N. Africa
 
http://home.att.net/~jbaugher1/p39_18.html
 
http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/9376/airacobra.htm

Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

Was the 350th FG the last US group flying the P-39 ?
It must have been something to fly the P-39 then go into the bigger P-47.
 

Rick --

From http://home.att.net/~jbaugher1/p39_17.html

The Airacobra reached its peak usage in the USAAF in early 1944, with over 2100 in service. However, the drawdown was fairly rapid after this, as they were quickly replaced by P-38s, P-47s and P-51s. By April of 1944, the last P-39 squadrons in New Guinea (the 82nd and 110th Tactical Reconnaissance Squadrons) had turned in their Airacobras for other aircraft. The 347th Fighter Group was the last to fly the Airacobra in the Southwest Pacific in August of 1944 before re-equipping with P-38s. Thereafter, P-39Qs were flown at training bases in the United States until the end of the war.

The 350th FG transitioned AUG/SEPT of 1944, so it had to be pretty close.

Fred Smith of the 347th did a piece comparing the P-39/P-47 in "Red Ass Screams", I'll see if I can get it to you somehow. James Hudson of the Devilhawks talks a little about it HERE as well.

Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

I know they kept their RAF serial numbers, but did the P-400's re-acquired from the Brits retain their British camo scheme when in service with the 350th FG, or were they given the OD top/gray bottom treatment upon entering USAAF service?

Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

Tom.......bearing in mind the apparent lack of photos of these P-400s it's hard to say; the shots of OD-NG Airacobras are most likely P-39Ls, Ns or Qs.
The British-contract planes ( Model 14s ) were supplied in British colours of Dark Earth, Dark Green and Sky ( or rather the US equivalents), by the time the first ones arrived here the RAF day fighter scheme had changed to greys and greens ( Aug. 1941 ). In the event they were sent to the Russians in those colours.
 
Those Model 14 Airacobra Is designated as P-400s and equipping parts of the 81st and 350th FGs and 68th OG in Morocco-Algeria in early 1943 ----still in RAF green/brown, ---I would think would have kept those colours as they were now operating over Tunisia; I can't see there would be the time or need to re-paint them. The Ninth and Twelfth AFs were giving many of their fighters and light and medium bombers a 2-colour scheme (OD or green over sand ) having left the desert behind. Most tactical aircraft delivered in OD-NG seemed to keep those colours which anyway faded to a lighter tone.
The other day scheme, mid-stone/dark earth/ azure blue (as on many P-40s ) was factory-applied as per British Purchasing Commision requests. It's always possible that the P-400s green was replaced by mid-stone or sand but I hardly think that was an urgent requirement bearing in mind the situation on the ground.
 
The P-400s in the Fifth-Thirteenth AFs kept their colours and serials but some were re-painted OD-NG as per the P-39s.                                                  Regards   Nick

Steve "Pancho" Gomez might have added a bit of help here.  I don't know if there are any external differences visible between a P-400 and a P-39 (was the only difference the cannon?), but in the attached photo, if you look closely, it looks like a camo OD/Sand British scheme.  Or am I just seeing what I want to see?

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Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

Since you guys are talking about the P39's of the 350th, I thought I'd send a picture of Al by his and a quik quote on what he thought of them compared to the P47's
  
"Incidently, our slogan on the P39 was Swift and Deadly. Asbury and I changed our jacket emblems to read Slow and Deadly. The guns were pitiful. Rowdy Dow got 2 ME 109s with a P39, and I don't know how he did it. The last flyable P39 is a San Marcos, TX.
Al "

Re: above photo background before Sardinia 1944
 
11 Jun 43, 42-18393, Bell P-39N-1-BE Airacobra, Kolstad, Robert F, 345FS, 350FG, 12AF, Badly damaged in belly landing, 345FS, 350FG, Maison Blanche, Algeria 

The P-400s had the long 20mm cannon and 12 exhausts per side ( except the few in 601 Sqn. RAF which had 6 fish-tail ones added ).
The underside in your photo is RAF "sky" ( US sky grey ) and the tail top looks like dark green; the factory scheme had a distinctive division under the tail, see attached P-400 in S. Pacific. When re-painted the top colours were brought down the fuselage. Serials were marked on the sky.            Nick

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Great photo of BW167 Nick. I have her with 67th Fighter Squadron, 347th Fighter Group arrive at Henderson Field, Guadalcanal, August 1942,  My notes add plane later Coded 6 on the tail

 Good going on the research Robert. Ether the P-39-N that was damaged on 11 June 43 was rebuilt or the date could be wrong on the photo.Could you find out what happened to it after it was damaged in the belly landing?
 
Tony

To date I have nothing further on 42-18393, having read about the ingenuity of the Ground Crews and Maintenance Repair Units I think it is highly probrble the plane flew again begore 1944. If someone had the P-39 history card for the plane it might shed more light on it.
 
Rob