Tex Longhorn


JOHN HORVATH, JR. served with the 75th Ftr. Sqdn., 23rd Ftr. Gp. in China. After training at Ft. Custer; Aerial Gunnery School at Kingman, AZ and Radio Operator School, Truax Field, Madison, WI, he was sent to Kunming, China. He flew daily flights as radio operator on four engine aircraft. He did regular pre flight and post flight inspections of radio equipment in aircraft; operated radio equipment using both radio telegraphy and radio telephoning while flying; operated and maintained .50 caliber machine guns mounted in bomber aircraft. He served from Dec. 22, 1941 to Jan. 18, 1946 and was discharged with the rank of staff sergeant. His awards and citations include: Asiatic Pacific Theater Ribbon w/Bronze Star, Good Conduct Medal, WWII Victory Medal and Lapel Button.
This info came from the book "Chennault's Flying Tigers WWII 50th Anniversary." It was put together by the 14th AF Association and published by Turner Publishing in 1996. Someone knows something about John Horvath. It has to be a close family member given all the family info listed.

The thing that sticks out to me, is that it says he was with the 75th fighter squadron. I'm just a novice, but I don't think the 75th had any bombers. It also mentions four engine planes. Maybe he was involved with supplies.

Just some thoughts I'm throwing out there.

I am currently reading the book Sharks Over China by Carl Molesworth (Castle 2001, reprinted from Brassey 1994, ISBN 0-7858-1401-9), and it made me start to think about a Thread I had written in June, 2007.  I was seeking information for a peer of mine at work, and, thanks to "Tex Longhorn," he had found the information I was seeking, but segments of his post (my highlights in bold blue), have brought up more questions.  According to the bio on John Horvath, he was associated with the 23 FG, 75 FS in Kunming but "flew in four engine A/C."  My assumption is that these would have been B-24D's arriving in May of 1943 as part of the 308 BG.  As the Libs began heavy bombardment deep into Japanese territories, they were supported by the "Sharks."  What I am trying to ascertain is the "connection between the bio and the historical facts."  I've talked with my peer, but he stated that there were very few records left in the family from his father and that my initial search was the most he had.  Is there anyone else who can shine some light on this or help me tie some more facts together?  (Note:  this thread started out about B-24's in the 14th AAF, and  maybe it should be relocated....Scott's call!)     Best Regards!  Steven

Best Regards!
Steven P. Puhl
Willow Run Historian  (RET.)  
Home of 8685 Ford B-24 Liberators
Life Member: Yankee Air Museum

 I just read the unit history for the 308th BG.  This history was in the same book as Horvath's bio. 

The four squadrons of the 308th were:

373rd in Yangkai
374th in Chengkung
375th in Chengkung
425th in Kunming

So we have a city match of Kunming and a 375th squadron which is close to the 75th squadron mentioned in the bio.

14th AAF 23rd FG 118th TRS

WillowRun


I am currently reading the book Sharks Over China by Carl Molesworth (Castle 2001, reprinted from Brassey 1994, ISBN 0-7858-1401-9), and it made me start to think about a Thread I had written in June, 2007.  I was seeking information for a peer of mine at work, and, thanks to "Tex Longhorn," he had found the information I was seeking, but segments of his post (my highlights in bold blue), have brought up more questions.  According to the bio on John Horvath, he was associated with the 23 FG, 75 FS in Kunming but "flew in four engine A/C."  My assumption is that these would have been B-24D's arriving in May of 1943 as part of the 308 BG.  As the Libs began heavy bombardment deep into Japanese territories, they were supported by the "Sharks."  What I am trying to ascertain is the "connection between the bio and the historical facts."  I've talked with my peer, but he stated that there were very few records left in the family from his father and that my initial search was the most he had.  Is there anyone else who can shine some light on this or help me tie some more facts together?  (Note:  this thread started out about B-24's in the 14th AAF, and  maybe it should be relocated....Scott's call!)     Best Regards!  Steven

  The 50 years between his death and the referenced biography most probably led to some inaccuracies in the "facts" as related by someone else. He was trained as a Radio Operator and as an Aerial Gunner, therefore one would presume he would be assigned to a unit needing a radio-gunner.  The bio mentions 4-engine aircraft and in the 14th Air Force that could only be B-24s of the 308th Bm Grp.
   The bio also mentions Kunming. As previously pointed out the 425th Bm Squadron was stationed there, from 20 Mar 43 to 18 Feb 45.  The 75th Ftr Sqn moved around a lot, but spent a brief period, 26 Apr - 11 Oct 43, stationed at Kunming.  Based on his military entry date and his identified training it is probable he would have gone overseas in the Feb-Apr 1943 time frame, coincidental with the 308th's deployment and/or the 75th's time at Kunming.
    Personnel of the 425th did not fly "daily" and it would be very seldom that non-pilot's in the 75th would get to fly.
   I do not have a complete roster of the 308th Bm Grp, but somewhere I have a listing of the initial cadre.  I am currently away on business. I will find it and check for Horvath when I return home.

Tony Strotman, MSgt (ret.), USAF
Son of T/Sgt Francis E. Strotman, Engineer-Gunner,
491st Bm Sq / 341st Bm Gp (M), Yangkai, China
"USAAF in CBI Tribute" http://www.usaaf-in-cbi.com

Tony,  Thanks for the post in respect to my "resurrected" search on John Horvath.  I sort of "WAGGED" into the same conclusion,but, again, some of the details weren't matching up as "Tex Longhorn" also had discovered.  I'd like to get a scan of the 308th's history page on John.  I'm also trying to find something else to read, and if you have anything else, PM me or post Site Wide.  TX!  Best Regards!  Steven

Best Regards!
Steven P. Puhl
Willow Run Historian  (RET.)  
Home of 8685 Ford B-24 Liberators
Life Member: Yankee Air Museum

This past week John Horvath Jr.'s son gave me a copy of his "Separation Qualification Record" which had the following in the "Summary of Military Occupations:" 
radio operator mechanic gunner:  with 75th Fighter Sqadron, 23rd Fighter Group in China for 6 months, flew regular daily flights as radio operator on four engine aircraft.  did regular pre-flight and post-flight inspection of radio eqipment in aircraft.  operated radio equipment using both radio telegraphly and radio telephoning while flying.  Was familiar with standard radio procedures.
The description ends here.  Could it be that the "6 months of service in Kunming" was when he worked with the 308 BG wherein he flew in "four engine aircraft" (B-24's).  His Military Occupational Assignments are listed as:
Basic A.C. 521; Military Policeman 677; Radio Operator Mechanic Guner 757; Aircraft Armorer 911.
There seems to be a mix here, and, not being a VET, I was surprised that there was, what appears to be, cross-functional duties between bomber/fighter groups.  Or, as was suggested in another post, just a confusion of the facts over time.  Since his father had passed when Tom was still a toddler, there was no recollection, and practically nothing left in the family's collection of memorabilia.  Still trying to piece it together.
 

Best Regards!
Steven P. Puhl
Willow Run Historian  (RET.)  
Home of 8685 Ford B-24 Liberators
Life Member: Yankee Air Museum