Kurtl
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CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
Hello to everyone, I am looking out for the crewmember-list of the B17G "The Irish Orphans". Does such a document exist? This plane crashed on May 10th 1944 in Lower Austria. I found some parts of it in the woods. Maybe somebody can help me identify them? On the one part I found some serial numbers. 3-14911 and 6-10473. Maybe someone owns a spare-part-list of a B17G. Thanks for any help. nice regards from Austria, Kurtl
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ssg keay
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Part 3-14911 is called a Hinge Assembly Cowling Flap and the B-17G had 48 of those. And 6-10473 is called a Lever. Both parts come from the engines and before you ask, yes I have a Parts Manual as I excavate planes in Germany :) Danny
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Kurtl
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Danny, thank you very much! From where you got such an manual? That sounds so great. I would like to see it. Can you post it here or send it to my email adress? Kurtl
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martyjhawk
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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"The Irish Orphans" was serial number 42-31804, and was part of the 775th BS of the 463rd BG. This squadron was also known as "The Irish Orphans". The crew on the date it was shot down were: 2nd Lt. Gerald F. Gowen, Pilot 2nd Lt. John T. Farrington, Co-Pilot 2nd Lt. Harold S. Mohler, Nav. Sgt. Harold P. Kennedy, Bomb. Sgt. Leo H. Brisson, Upper Turret Sgt. Anthony Nicholopoulos, Ball Turret Sgt. Theodore F. Dawson, Radio Sgt. Jonathan L. Punzar, Right Waste Sgt. Robert L. Nutty, Left Waste Sgt. Robert D. Omundson, Tail Gunner
The MACR for the plane is 4660. The list of names came from the book "Allyn's Irish Orphans". The MACR number came from Dick Drain's "5th Bomb Wing" book. Neith of these books says what happened to the crew. Marty
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jpeters140
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Marty....A check of the abmc website www.abmc.gov and the 775th BS 463rd BG shows Brisson, Nickelopolous, and Punzar buried in the Ardennes American Cemetery., France Kennedy,and Dawson are buried in the Lorraine American Cemetery, France. Whether the other members survived, or were KIA and remains returned to a local cemetery, are unknown, as far as the abmc website is concerned....only the MACR and IDPF will tell for sure. Jim :-)
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James S. Peters Sr. T/Sgt B-17 Flt Engr, 27 missions 99 BG, 348BS, 5th Wing, 15th AAF Tortorella, (Foggia#2), Italy My Tour was from 12/03/44-06/19/45 M/Sgt USAF (Retired)
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Kurtl
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Marty, thanks for your help! Maybe you can find out the names of the crew of Stanley Dwyer from May 10th 1944. I believe that my documents are wrong. Not "The Irish Orphans" crashed on that day, it was the "Pete's Playhouse". My information about that day is that this B17G was hit by anti aircraft gunfire at Wiener Neustadt (Wr. Neustadt). Unfortunately the bomb release mechanism was blocked at that hit and at least one engine cought fire. 5 men jumped out and survived. The plane crased in Lower Austria. They found 3 bodies close to the wreck. One was hanging on his paracute and was killed by the bomb-explosion. After the war in 1946 2 were burried in France and one in the United States (I'm not sure of that). 2 crewmembers (pilot Stanley Dwyer and one gunner) are still missing. I am looking now for the names of that crew and trying to find out more details what happend to them on that day. Kurtl
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Alex Smart
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Hi, Farrington and Mohler both became POW's, the rest of the crew perrished. The 775th Bomber Squadron were ALL "The Irish Orphans". Named because of the scarcity of Irish in the Squadron, (Irish-Americans I presume). KURTL, Please look in the thread on Pete's Playhouse in this section of armyairforce .com. Crews names are all there. Alex
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ssg keay
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Kurtl, the manual is almost 300 pages thick and I am right now trying to scan and then burn it on a CD. Danny
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Historiker
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Hi Kurtl, I am from Wiener Neustadt, the city wich were bombed by the 463rd BG on the 10th of May. I think I have some useful information. I published a book over the Air War over Wiener Neustadt during WW II. On that certain day the 15th USAAF lost 30 bombers and four fighters over Wiener Neustadt. It was one of the greatest Air battles over Austria during the WWII. 7 B17 were lost by the 463rd BG. Three groups on that day had no sufficient esort. One of them was the 463rd BG. Pete´s Playhouse and Irish Orpahns were both shot down on that day. There is something wrong with the MACR´s of that two planes. Some dates were mixed up: 1. Pete´s Playhouse 42-31685: The Dwyer Plane. MACR 4660 The plane was named after the copilot. His name was Pete. The plane crashed in Vöstenhof south of Wiener Neustadt. 5 bailed out. 5 were killed. 2. Irish Orphans 42-31804: The Gowen Plane. MACR 4723. The name of the plane came from the sqadron. The plane crashed near Lichtenwörth east of Wiener Neustadt. 2 bailed out. 8 were killed. In the two MACR´s the mixed up the serials of the planes. So that means 42-31804 crashed in Lichtenwörth and 42-31685 crashed in Vösenhof. It is mentioned in the wrong way in the MACR´s. The two serials and all the number of the maschine guns were mixed up. I have a picture of the Gowen crew and a picture of the Irish Orphans in my book. I also have a picture of the crew of the Dwyer crew. Where did you find the parts of the B17. If it was Lichtenwörth, then it was the "Irish Orphans", thats for sure. Greetings Max
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Alex Smart
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Hello Max, Thank you for this info. So it looks like the MACR numbers 4660 and 4723 relate to the correct aircraft but that some of the information within these MACR's is mixed up , i.e the serial numbers of guns and serial numbers of the two aircraft. From this website, Joe Baugher's and the AAIR websites all have the MACR 4660 = 42-31804 and MACR4723 = 42-31685. So at least all are agreed that the MACR numbers's are matched to the correct aircraft ? It is the details within those MACR's that is now in question. Many thanks Max Alex
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khughes
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Hello Kurt, My Uncle, 1 Lt Stanley N. Dwyer, was the pilot of Pete's Playhouse. He is MIA. My dad was also a B-17 pilot with the 8th AF. We recently visited Austria and the crash site and erected a memorial stone to the fallen crew. As for the crew: 1 Lt Stanley N. Dwyer - pilot - MIA TSgt John J. Boros - Flt Eng/top turret - MIA 2nd Lt Francis Gilhooley - navigator - KIA - originally buried in local cemetery disinterred to USA--buried in New York TSgt Prescott C. Piper - toggler - KIA - originally buried in local cemetery distinterred to US Military Cemetery, Neuville-en Condroz, Liege, Belgium SSgt William Olfenius - tailgunner - KIA - originally buried in local cemetery disinterred to US Military Cemetery, Neuville-en Condroz, Liege, Belgium TSgt George D. Mitchell - radio operator - POW SSgt Eugene Parker - ball turret - POW SSgt John Boyett - waist gunner - POW SSgt Stephen Milewski - waist gunner - POW 2 Lt Manley Dale - co-pilot - POW Historiker has correct info. Contact me offline for more info.
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svatczech
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Hi Max-historiker, I would want to contact you regarding your book of Wiener Neustadt missions. Please, contact me on address: svatavel@netscape.net Thanks. Svat., Czech aviation historian
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helena1266
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Leo H. Brisson was my uncle, if any of you have information or knew him, any information would be greatly appreciated! Thank you.
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jrka852
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RE: CREW MEMBER LIST AND PARTS OF B17G, "THE IRISH ORPHANS"
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Hi Max-historiker, I would want to contact you regarding your book of Wiener Neustadt missions. Please, contact me on address:jrka852@seznam.cz Thanks Jirka Czech aviation historian
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