Any info on this plane and crew. My Uncle Donald McVicar was the navigator.

Hi John,
 
Project Bits and Pieces shows "The House of Lords" to be
42-5881 XM G attached to the 332nd Squadron. This plane was at Stillwater, OK on 04 October 1945. Nothing on the crew.
 
Vic

John,
To add to what Vic has provided.  The known pilots that flew 42-5881 were:
 

Adams, Lundak, Myers, Amphlett,Gault, Steele, Walker, Jarrel 

credit link: http://94thbombgroup.com/94thB-14.htm 
 
Photo from: http://94thbombgroup.com/noseart9.htm 

 
You might concentrate on the above pilots to place your uncle with one of these crews.  Good Luck!
-Keith

-Keith Hardie
Nephew of John David Hardie, 447th BG waist gunner.
www.447bg.com

John,
I found a Donald D. McVicar with the 94th BG.  A 2LT who was WIA 05-19-43.
 
Dave

Link to: Bombardiers of WWII Website

New email address as of Feb 2006: hfhmsite@comcast.net

Thank you Dave, I'm just starting out here and appreciate the info and link. Evidently the bombardier was killed at the same time . My uncle was in back of him.

I have a copy of "Lingering Contrails of the Big Square A" (94th BG history).  I try and see what's in there on The House of Lords.  May of '43 is early.  That might be part of the original group.
 
Andy Mays in Maine

94th BG B - 17 # 239788 also named " The House of Lords " 332d Sq. XM-M.
Take off accident May 10, 44.
Cheers

Thanks Keith,  I am wondering why
the House of Lords had so many pilots. Was this normal? I think the limit on bombing missions was achieved and more.     John

It's hard to say.  Some of those pilots might have only flown one or two missions in it.

John,
 
I am curious about your statement about the limit on bombing missions being achieved. I have never heard of a "limit" and know that there were some planes that flew 100+ missions. It was unusual for one to be able to accomplish that but not impossible and don't think they were trying to reach a certain number in order to be taken out of service.
 
Vic

First in response to shooshoobaby's 42-39788 as being also named House of Lords.  I think this is an error, 42-39788 is shown to have the nickname of "Hard to Get". 

John, to comment on your,

the House of Lords had so many pilots. Was this normal? I think the limit on bombing missions was achieved and more.     John

  Well this Fortress had 8 different pilots, which one might consider this a low amount. 
One of the myths about the bombing effort was that crews had their "own" plane that they flew on every mission.  Yes there may be some isolated case where some crews did or came close.  The reality is that most crews flew several different planes during their individual tour(s).  Now with that been said, many crews did have a particular plane that they identified with as theirs, usually the one they flew most often.   Even fewer crews had the opportunity to "name" an aircraft, especially late in the airwar. 
Further, on the comment about the limit on bombing missions.  As Vic, mentioned some planes reached the Century Ship status for completing 100 missions. The 447th bg's "Scheherazade" is credited with 126 missions without a single mechanical abort, second highest in the 447th, after "Milk Wagon" (129)
Scherherzade had some 54 different pilots fly her. 

Even The Memphis Belle had many different pilots other than Capt Morgan. 

To gain mor information on your father, you might check with the 94th BG Association.  Here is a link :  http://www.94thbombgroup.com/index.shtml

-Keith

-Keith Hardie
Nephew of John David Hardie, 447th BG waist gunner.
www.447bg.com

Keith, I meant to ask about the individual "human" limit on combat missions. Im sure that was surpassed all the time. Was there an official limit?   sorry, just a novice here.   John

John,
 
Well, that certainly was a misunderstanding of your train of thought. There were different mission requirements in the different areas. The 8th Air Force started out with a 25 mission requirement before a man could rotate home. This was raised to 30 about April 1944 and then to 35 some months later. The 15th Air Force had some different system that was based on sorties or missions. I think that 50 was the requirement but somehow or other 35 also had some significance. I'm sure that Jules or Jim will give some insight. This mission requirement thing has been kicked from pillar to post in many past forums. You can probably put the topic in the search mode and come up with a lot of answers. As far as the "human maximum" is concerned, I feel sure that it was exceeded by many of the men who never reached the required number. Those guys gave their all for our freedom and deserve nothing but the highest praise and thanks  for their sacrifices.
 
Vic

Vic,
You are correct, the topic of 'required' # missions to rotate home, has been discussed many times. 

John, 
This is a 'large' forum and new people join all the time, here are links to the two more recent threads that discuss this history.  There are more for sure.

As far as your comment about being a 'novice', hey no worries we all started there.  Just start poking around this forum and read some threads, your learning curve will go way up.  There is a goldmine of information here!  (One more Big Thanks to Scott Burris for launching this very important website, Ya done good Lad!!)

Here are the links:
http://forum.armyairforces.com/m_88435/tm.htm

and
http://forum.armyairforces.com/m_77282/tm.htm

Cheers!
-Keith
 
Vic, you know it's only a matter of time before we see another post about which is better the B-17 or the B-24?  I like Scott's answer: The B-29! 
Classic!!

-Keith Hardie
Nephew of John David Hardie, 447th BG waist gunner.
www.447bg.com

John,
My name is Jim Spofford. Your Uncle was an original member of the same crew my father was assigned to. Capt. Urban S. Adams was thier Pilot. Thier original plane was the "FiFi"  (42-31599). I have a picture of the crew in front of thier plane taken in Presque Isle, Maine. Picture taken just before they went to England. Be glad to give you any info and copy of pictures I have. My father is still alive and would be glad to ask him any questions you have. My father's name is Phil S. Spofford. He was the ball turret gunner in the crew.  

     John and Jim,
B-17F 42-29699 XM-F "Fi-Fi"     19 May 1943, Flensburg
332nd Squadron
Capt. Urban S. "Jack" Adams (P)
Capt. Kenneth S. "Buck" Steele (CP) WIA
Lt. Charles B. Scott (B)  KIA
Lt. Donald D. McVicar (N)  WIA
S/Sgt. Norman Rowe Jr. (RG)
S/Sgt. Aloyse N. Krass (WG)
S/Sgt. Albert S. Kleckner (TT)
S/Sgt. John J. Cassidy (TG)
S/Sgt. Philip S. Spofford (BT)
S/Sgt. Norman W. Stone (WG)
Up: 0947  Down: 1618
Target attacked at 1330 hours, at 23,000 feet, with 1 bomb, 9 were
jettisoned in sea on return trip.
Flak: at target, 1330 hours, 23,000 feet. Moderate black flak.
Encountered 25-30 FW-190's, three claimed destroyed.
A/C: top vertical stabilizer blown off, #3 engine blown away, tail riddled with 30 cal. bullets.
Charley Scott was killed, Capt. Steele (the Executive Officer)
was grazed on the side of his head by a 30 cal bullet.
After 19 May they were assigned 42-5881 XM-G/H "The House Of Lords". When the 332nd arrived in England they were attached to the 91st BG at Bassingbourn (of "Memphis Belle" fame). There is a 91st video pertaining to "Memphis Belle" which in part two, briefly shows the tail damage of 42-29699 XM-F "Fi-Fi" as well as 2 other 94th A/C.
U. S. Adams last mission was on 5 November 1943.


http://www.dailymotion.com/related/x3sfom_6stormo-il2-movie_videogames/video/x1wupt_the-memphis-belle-2_events?from=rss

At 11:25 of the video is "Fi-Fi". Look closely as some of the guys around the shot-up A/C "should" be 94th personnel.
   Also go to:  www.91stbombgroup.com  click on Dailies of the 401st, 1943, scroll down to 23 April and your dad's are shown as arriving. On 26 April other 94th crews arrive. On 3 May your dad's are sent to Gun School.
  Hope this answers a couple of your questions, regards, Marc

Jim and Marc,
   Thanks for all that new information on my Uncle. I had not heard of the 1st B-17, "Fi-Fi" . this must have been the one that he was wounded on when the bombardier was killed in front of him. I always thought it was on the "House of Lords" I watched the video and at about 11:14 in it shows someone who looks like my Uncle Donald. I will show this to my Dad. Jim, I would greatly appreciate a copy of the crew picture of the "Fi-Fi"
    Thanks Again,  John McVicar