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 Ploesti August 1, 1943
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designer1315

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 07/04/2007 09:17:40 PM
Hi-
Thanks for your response. Here is some more info:
 
EUROPEAN THEATER. FLEW 27 MISSIONS AS MEMBER OF A B-24 LIBERATOR CREW, 93RD BOMB GROUP.
 
Nancy
93rd joe

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 07/05/2007 12:09:42 AM
Nancy
There are many 93rd vets that remember your father, Don Grimes. He was one of the original members of TEDS TRAVELLING CIRCUS. One of them is Ben Kuroki, the first Japanese American gunner in the MIGHTY EIGHTH. We are getting together in Lincoln, NE Aug 1 2007  to kick off a movie Premiere about Ben's military history. Your father still has many that remember him as the Radio Operator in Chuck Merrill crew (THAR SHE BLOWS)
 
Drop me a line at my E-mail address DOGPATCHRAIDER@msn.com
I would like to stay in contact and have more info that I would like to share.
My uncle Joe Avendano flew with Chuck Merrill as a co-pilot state side before
they were sent over to the Europe in Sept of 1942.
 
Best Regards
Joe Avendano Duran
WillowRun

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 07/22/2007 07:10:30 PM
I  picked up a copy this evening of Masters of the Air by Donald Miller in which there is a good descriptive section in the chapter "The Bells of Hell" recounting the low level raid.  He has drawn upon several sources and it actually makes for easy reading.  Again, as has been sighted in this thread, there has been many questions over time about the execution of the plan.  Overall, Miller's book is decent reading.    Steven
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Steven P. Puhl
Willow Run Historian (RET.)
"Home of 8685 Ford Built Liberators"
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WillowRun

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 11/11/2007 01:37:18 PM
Thought I'd go back to Blackie's Thread to re-read it after having purchsed and read 1/3 of the new book by Duane Schultz entitled Into The Fire:  Ploesti, The Most Fateful Mission of World War II (Westholme October 2007). It is a interesting look at this catastrphic event in aviation history, and just reading the prologue will make you want to read the whole book.  What I found refreshing was that it told the story of an event without "buying or selling."  It was an event that involved many, and Duane has attempted to tell their story of the "many" without assigning heroes or goats.  Although this is more appropriate on "the book corner sub-forum," I have already posted it there.  I've also attached a couple of reviews.    Best Regards!   Steven
 
From Publishers Weekly
Schultz (The Most Glorious Fourth) combines a historian's meticulous research and a novelist's hypnotic prose to produce this memorable popular history of the World War II aerial attack on Hitler's oil refineries at Ploesti, Romania. British PM Winston Churchill called Ploesti the taproot of German might, and at the Casablanca Conference in January 1943, he-along with U.S. President Franklin Roosevelt-approved a massive aerial attack against the facilities. The attack was optimistically projected to shorten the war against Germany by at least six months, but in reality planners relied on misleading and inadequate intelligence and unconventional-and untested-low-level bombing. Col. John Killer Kane, commander of one of the bombardment groups tasked with the raid, deemed the operation idiotic. Nevertheless, on August 1, 1943, an armada of 177 B-24 Liberators took off from Benghazi, Libya, for Ploesti, where they encountered one of the most heavily defended targets in the world. One-third of the bombers and their crews were lost. Despite the heroism of the air crews-five Medals of Honor were awarded for the mission-the raid was a monumental foul-up. Three refineries escaped any damage, and most of those that were hit were quickly repaired. Schultz's intimate account of this controversial episode is a timely reminder of the horrors of war and a moving tribute to Ploesti's heroes. 24 illus. (Oct.)

Book Description
We were dragged through the mouth of hell."--from a Ploesti Mission debriefing report
"We knew it was a disaster and knew that in the flames shooting up from those refineries we might be burned to death. But we went right in."--Lieutenant Norman Whalen
Planned by Winston Churchill, authorized by Dwight D. Eisenhower, and executed by five specially trained American bomber units, the attack on the oil refineries of Ploesti, Romania, was among the most daring and dangerous missions of World War II. If the raid succeeded, the Nazi war machine would suffer a devastating blow. On August 1, 1943, nearly two hundred B-24 bombers flew from Benghazi, North Africa, with directions to descend on Ploesti at treetop level, bomb the refineries, and return. The low-level bombers could evade enemy radar and were thought to be more difficult to shoot down. But despite warnings that a German heavy flak train had been moved into the area and that the secrecy of their mission had been compromised, the bombers were sent out. Minutes from the target, one of the commanders made a wrong turn, leading the formations away from Ploesti. Recovering from this mistake, most of the bombers relocated the refineries, but the mission was doomed. The ensuing air-ground battle claimed dozens of the bombers, and many of those that survived the ordeal were forced to ditch in the ocean or in remote areas due to lack of fuel or structural damage.
In Into the Fire: Ploesti, The Most Fateful Mission of World War II, Duane Schultz re-creates this great battle, combining original research and interviews with survivors in order to capture the tension, drama, and heroics of the warring sides. More Medals of Honor were awarded for this mission than any other aerial combat enterprise in the history of the United States. But the medals are bittersweet testimony to the courage of the 1,726 young men who risked all on a fateful attempt to cut off the Nazi supply of "black gold."

Best Regards!
Steven P. Puhl
Willow Run Historian (RET.)
"Home of 8685 Ford Built Liberators"
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stoyanov

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/18/2008 04:46:43 PM
Hi to all members,
The Ploesti mission and the Tidal Wave Operation have turned my dad into a hero in ww2 (if you like you can read how this happened in the website   http://vstoyano.sky.prohosting.com/ )but also have interested me in all this epic and heroic clash between the two opponent airforces-Allied and Axis -with all the glory of the deadly fights they had in air and on ground in 1943-1944.
I keep now an archive of books, stories, photos ,paintings and videoclips abt. all aerial combats over my homeland which unfortunately happened to be on the way to Ploesti and hostile to the Allied AF!
Thanks to all of you who discuss this theme  in this nice forum.
 vesko stoyanov
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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/18/2008 05:10:43 PM
Vesko,   Welcome aboard!    The 01AU43 Low Level Ploesti Raid is one that gets much attention.  I am sure that any articles, photos or whatever would be most appreciated!  In one of my Threads (Ploesti: Low Level Raid)  I talk about one of my GM WR (formerly FO WR) employees who had been conscripted by the Germans and fired 88 Flak against our  B-24's.  Best Regards!  Steven

[image]local://upfiles/11777/7173C7E4A06340AA967141AD3B87F2CD.jpg[/image]
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Steven P. Puhl
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stoyanov

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/21/2008 01:00:30 AM
Thank you Steven.Soon I will send to you if you like some pics and or stories on the topic -aerial war over Bulgaria.I am curious and will appreciate any info about  a B-24 Liberator(obviously from the 15-th AF downed over Sofia on April 17 .1944 by a ramming in its tail.This was actually the second "Live Torpedo " hit executed  by our aviation by the  bulg. Me-109 pilot Nedelcho Bonchev. He is today mentioned as hero for this but also for his fight  later iafter Sept. 1944  when Bulgaria switched politicaly and began  to fight against the german troops in Serbia, so he did some sorties with his me-109 against german ground forces but  one day was  shot  down by their flak  and being wounded by the crash  he was captured by them.Some days later  the germans moved to the west and according to other POW's who survived the war he was killed by the nacy guards  as he refused to move with them.The picture of the ramming is embedded here.
Rgrds Vesko

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Fabry

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/26/2008 11:43:54 AM
Hi from Sicily!

About Ploesti raid there is a documetary on-line (in French), go to:
http://dailymotion.alice.it/relevance/search/b24/video/x3spir_1ploesti-bombardement_events     (first part)
http://dailymotion.alice.it/relevance/search/b24/video/x3snb7_2-ploesti-bombardement_events  (second part)

The second part is very interesting! Second you, are some scenes really filmed during the raid?

CIAO!
Fabry
Ernie Pyle wrote: "They died and others lived and nobody knows why it is so. There's nothing we can do for the ones beneath the wooden crosses, except perhaps to pause and murmur, 'Thanks, pal.'"
WillowRun

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/26/2008 02:19:51 PM
Fabry,   C'est bien formidable! Merci beaucoup!  The link is a "good visual" and the clarity of the video is great!  Didn't mind the French "Overlay" at all as I could still follow most of it.  You are right, worth viewing even though a lot of the footage has appeared on the History Channel, and, sorry to say, it is more of a "Hollywood Production Video!"   However, it is still an amazing bit of history to relive.  Thanks again for sharing the information.  Best Regards and Adieux!    Steven
<message edited by rzrj3b on 01/26/2008 05:01:35 PM >
Best Regards!
Steven P. Puhl
Willow Run Historian (RET.)
"Home of 8685 Ford Built Liberators"
Life Member: Yankee Air Museum
WillowRun

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/26/2008 02:30:26 PM
Vesko,  Could you please provide more info on the painting and the event which you described as best you know it?  Best Regards!  Steven

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Steven P. Puhl
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WillowRun

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/26/2008 05:23:45 PM

You are right:  worth viewing even though a lot of the footage has appeared on the History Channel, and, sorry to say, it is more of a "Hollywood Production Type Video!"

 
Fabry,   I believe I owe an explanation to you and to the Readers/Posters to this Site.  I have seen, over time, many videos of "wartime footage," and I have learned that there is "REEL and REAL."  Although these clips due indeed portray "minimal actual B/W footage" of the Ploesti Low Level Raid of 01AU43, it also portrays subsequent high level Ploesti raids interspersed with footage of other missions throughout WWII to other targets.  Keep in mind that at that point in time (for Reader recognition), B-24D's in OD, CAMO and, to a degree, Desert Pink were the predominent A/C colors.  Take a look at both clips!  I'd say that the majority are "clean-skins" and variants other than "D's."  The "story-line" is still there, but with "poetic license."  I still thought it was interesting to watch, as I find the entire Ploesti "event" one of the most interesting of WW II AAF history.  As I've also posted, I also had a direct connection with a participant, who at that time was "attempting to shoot down our Libs."  Best Regards!  Steven
Best Regards!
Steven P. Puhl
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Skyguy5

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/26/2008 09:15:24 PM
S.P.,
   Are you asking about the pic of the B-24s?  If so, it is a very famous painting by the even more famous aviation artist, Robert Taylor.  It is called, "Ploesti-The Vital Mission".  If memory serves right it depicts "Hail Columbia" coming off the target.  The painting is worth $790 and is signed by five pilots including Compton.
Regards,
Hugh The OTD
"Swords Forever"
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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/27/2008 09:52:04 AM
Hugh,  I was asking about the print in Post #70.   I am aware of the marvelous collection by Robert Taylor, i.e. the "Hail Columbia" print attached to my #73 post.   Sorry, I might have confused the Readers!  There are some great Ploesti prints out there.  I've attached the B-24 "Hail Columbia" pic from the B24 Best Web.  Best Regards!  Steven

[image]local://upfiles/11777/101C221C908E45108E87E5731EDE09E7.jpg[/image]
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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/28/2008 02:23:14 AM
Hi Steven, Hi Farby,
I find now some time to visit the forum and reply to you.
Thanks for your replies and the interesting links provided by Farby.To my opinion Ploesti raid and the later ones on this region were as ZUNAMIs for our bulgarian modest Air Forces during the ww2 may be for the rumanian too.And unfortunately our small AF was obliged as ally of Germany to fight with this Zunami therefore attracting the heavy bombings of Sofia and other bulgarian cities with all the victims and losses that followed.
My dad who passed away in 1997, has wrote a book and several articles in some army magazines but to my pity I bacame interested in his carrier and war time experience just after his death.I found out in the  internet that the war topic is understandibly popular all over the world and most among the generation after the war whos grandfathers, uncles etc. were among the wariors.So I desided to create a webside and I did it and little by little started to gather more info ,photoes,pics etc. about this aerial war over Bulgaria in 43-44 when many of my dad's comrades died in battles against the Allied airforces.
 I have got and read books like : PLOESTI by Dugan and Steward,WOODBINE RED LEADER by George Loving(ace of P-51),and I personally contributed to col.Jay Stout for his excellent book FORTRESS PLOESTI and also to R.Johnson for his book GIDI GIDI BOOM BOOM- always with the idea to help world history research of this heroic events.I had a link with the famous PYRAMIDERS and their  magazine issued for  veterans of this famous bomb unit.
I think each one of you somehow is also linked with these events to become interested like you are in this matter.So I can further provide you by internet with some pictures, stories etc. from my own collection if you like .
Herewith I attach you 2 pages story about the 2 bulgarian LIVE TORPEDOES in that war (Spisarevsky and Bonchev).Bonchev is the one Steven asked  regarding the picture I posted some days ago.The full story about the best bulgarian royal airforce fighters in that aerial war is in 12 pages which I could send to your e-mails if you like of course.
Regarding any documental movies about Ploesti raid:Some years ago I was guest to a friend in Palo Alto,Calif. who was a profesor in the STANFORD University and he was fen of ww2 docum. movies having a big video collection on tapes.Than he showed to me a real wartime movie about the Tidal Wave operation and the german resistance to it-I remember it was made from german and us army sources and was shown on DISCOVERY chanel from where it was recorded by my friend.I could watch the terrible fight over Ploesti including the shooting of the German train armed with guns which runned very close parallel to the bombers.I forgot than to make for me a copy of that movie so later in Bulgaria I never found it.May be you have an idea about it and where I can order it.
Best regards
Vesko
stoyanov

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/28/2008 02:31:46 AM
One more...

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stoyanov

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/28/2008 02:34:25 AM
New trial..

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stoyanov

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/29/2008 12:49:28 AM
Steven,I got a reply from another forum:




Re: Info needed about bomber shot on April 17th
« Reply #1 on Jan 25, 2008, 6:56pm »
[link=http://b24bw.proboards33.com/index.cgi?board=B24Aircraft&action=post&thread=1201248729&quote=1201305403&page=1][/link]




Stoy -
MACR DATA Base shows 2 B - 24s lost 4/17/44
Both were 451st BG.
Mike

but where can I find details abt the 2 B-24s? Can you direct me?
Thanks.
Vesko
Al Blue

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/29/2008 04:31:43 AM
One Ploesti account not yet mentioned here is the late Roger Freeman's final book, "The Ploesti Raid - Through The Lens" (Battle of Britain International Limited, 2004, no ISBN given. See www.afterthebattle.com for ordering details.) Photos galore, formation charts, details on the mission itself as well as on each participating B-24 and crew - all treated with Roger's well-known ability to sort out truth from myth. Indexed. I heartily recommend it.
 
Al Blue 
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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943 - 01/29/2008 10:36:04 AM
Vesko:

From the MACR Database the two aircraft from the 451st BG lost on April 17, 1944 were
41-29220 (MACR 4078) & 42-52156 (MACR 4520)

This is from Mike Hill's "The 451st Bomb Group in World War II, A Pictorial History"

Mission 29: 04-17-44 Belgrade Zemin Airdrome

"On April 17, 1944 the 451st was in the air again. This time it was a trip to the airfield at Belgrade, Yugoslavia. Thirty-four planes dropped 1200 tons of "frags" on the field. Flak was classified as intense and very accurate. Many of the planes returned to base with battle damage. THE SOD BUSTER from the 727th landed with over two hundred holes in her hide."

725th Squadron
41-29220 NAUGHTY BUT NICE: Original squadron aircraft. Lost April 17, 1944. Original pilot J.C. Price (KIA) MACR 4078

42-52165 SLICK CHICK: Original squadron aircraft. Fate unknown.
MACR 4520

However, in MIke Hill & John Breitling's book "B-24 Liberators of the 15th Air Force/49th Bomb WIng in World War II" it says:

41-29220 NAUGHTY BUT NICE aka HONEY CHILD (725th)
An original aircraft of the group, she departed the USA on December 2, 1943, under the command of James G. Price and Crew #25. She was listed as MIA on April 17, 1944, during the Group's 29th mission. Sustained two flak hits near Mostar, Yugoslavia. Left formation and headed down. Three of the crew, commanded by James Price, bailed out (MACR #4078).

42-52165 SLICK CHICK (725th)
Departed the USA on December 2, 1943, with Frank Hamer's Crew #32. Transfered to the 449th Bomb Group shortly after arrival in the MTO. Lost with that group on April 23, 1944.

Ken
Ken Alexander
Son of 1st Lt. Clair B. Alexander Jr.
Pilot, B-24s: 10/12/1944 - 04/24/1945
15th AF, 49th Wing, 461st BG, 764th BS
Torretta Airfield, Cerignola, Italy
stoyanov

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RE: Ploesti August 1, 1943