Does anyone have a photo or depiction of a P-39 of the 347th? I've never seen on, and haven't had any luck online. Did the 347th change their squadron emblem when they went to the P-47 like the 346th did (from the skull/cobra to Goofy in the plane)?

I remember talking to my Grandpa about the P-39. He said that you got into it through a door like a car, the engine was behind the pilot and that one button fired the machine guns and another fired a 37mm cannon mounted in the nose. It fired out of the propeller hub, and he said it looked like someone was lobbing tennis balls out of the front of your aircraft when you fired it.

I guess Chuck Yeager flew them and loved it, and the Soviets made pretty good use of it, but overall it seems to be a much maligned aircraft in the USAAF and RAF.

Anyway, if anyone has a photo, I'd love to see it.

Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

Tom   this is a typical P-39N from the 347th, squadron ID by letter (or letters) on nose.
The squadron insignia was unofficial.                                  Nick

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Here is a couple from the 347 FS book.Got to remember the photo's are about a inch long so hard to focous for my camera.

[image]local://upfiles/10483/B2C2A1B7A1A54E1CAEA9A7236014CFBF.jpg[/image]

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another

[image]local://upfiles/10483/1AD1D8B68A29421BA9F40FA83A26CCC6.jpg[/image]

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last one.

[image]local://upfiles/10483/7D5FD33EAEEE4C03B2E114D0CD814928.jpg[/image]

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My grandfather flew the P-39 before going over to China. He was with the 118th TRS. Here is a picture with the door open.

http://forum.armyairforces.com/upfiles/9530/asppg_Hf986834699.jpg

I have posted many more p-39 pictures in the photo gallery under the fighter section.

http://forum.armyairforces.com/albumphoto.asp?albumid=20&asortType=1&apage=1

14th AAF 23rd FG 118th TRS

Thanks, fellas -- I am always amazed at how much knowledge the people on this site have and how much (and how quickly) they are willing to share it.  It is much appreciated.  Based on what BuckeyeUK shared, I think I found a photo of a restored P-39 from the CAF that closely resembles a 347th P-39:

[image]local://upfiles/13554/6F856F30909E4FF6810B2F783CED16CC.jpg[/image]

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Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

The pilot of  P-39 ZZ is Lt. Fred Smith 347th Sq.
Photos of 347th P - 39s K , W , R , ZZ
12th AF Story by Kenn Rust
Mike
 

Great crew on this thread.  Nice to see the interest.  Here's one of aircraft 'P' taken at Ghisonaccia, Corsica sometime in early-to-mid 1944.  A little hard to see, but the plane on the right and in the background is Texas Tornado, assigned to pilot Hugh McCall and crew chief Henry Embry
Cheers to all,
Bob

[image]local://upfiles/5932/AC282166F2E341E2A40032D6E7D9A019.jpg[/image]

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Some notes on Rick's pics.  That's 347th armorer Egon Andersen sitting on the wing of P-39 W.  Standing next to the open door of aircraft Y, The Ripper, is Lt. Rupert "Rip" Collins.
 
Bob

[image]local://upfiles/5932/0A201055AC144BA38362C7A7FA9F382F.jpg[/image]

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Okay, this has me curious... was there any "industry standard" for aircraft markings (other than national insignia)? With P-39's, the 345th used a 2 digit number, the 346th a letter on the door, and the 347th letters on the nose. When they switched to P-47's, it seems to have changed completely: the 345th and 347th put a squdron/flight/aircraft code on the fuselage in front of the national insignia (ie "7B5" was the 5th aircraft of B flight int the 347th squadron), while the Brazillian Squadron and the 346th put the same codes on the engine cowling. Other than these marks and the serial number, was everything else on the aircraft pilot/squadron commander discretion? What was the significance of the large red "A" on the tail of the 347th (345th had a lightning bolt, the 346th a checkered rudder)?

Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

Tom          the factory-applied markings included national insignia, serial, data panel and red "No step" colours on wing roots.
THEATRE markings added were     red spinners / cowl fronts from 1943 ( originally on Ninth AF P-40s in 1942 in line with the RAF ).
On P-39s, yellow fuselage and wing bands added for benefit of ground troops as many missions were ground attack.
On P-47s, red cowl fronts and / or prop hubs.
On A-36s / early P-51s, yellow wing bands as they resembled Me. 109s.
On Twelfth AF fighters for Operation Torch Nov. 1942 US flag decals were added to fuselage -wings ( it was thought the French would be more familiar with that ).
 
350th unit markings were generated at Group level (for some reason thay didn't normally have red cowls), ID was by squadron only...........yellow or silver lightning flash on black tail band (345th); black checks on silver rudder (346th); large red or black " A " on tail ( 347th ). Additional individual and squadron ID was by the unique 3-number/letter fuselage codes.
When the bars were added to the insignia in 1943 the factories applied the fuselage insignia completely behind the intercooler doors so no room on rear fuselage for markings; UK depots ( Eighth-Ninth AF ) usually re-applied the insignia further forward but in the MTO they didn't bother hence any markings were on vertical tail, nose or mid-fuselage.                            Nick  
 

Thanks BuckeyeUK... Great info. I know in the ETO when the Jug first came out the put yellow or white bands on the tail and wings to differentiate from the FW 190, although the ONLY similarity I can see is that they were both radial engines -- the FW 190 was quite a bit sleeker.

Any significance to the why a red "A" was the tail identifier for the 347th? Apparently it could have been anything... symbolic for "Red Ass" perhaps?

Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

Hi Tom,
 
Best we can tell the red A's of the 347th sq P-47s started appearing in Aug of 1944.  From their unit history: 
Major Raup (new Sq CO) painted the name "Red Ass Commander" on the front of his jeep.  To keep the insignia of the squadron before the world, he ordered a large "A" to be painted on the tail of each airplane. 
 
By the way, the kicking mule logo was officially adopted many months before and showed up on at least one P-39.  In this case it was painted on the cockpit doors.  Design was created by George Faltum and approved by then CO Major Francis Grable.   Squadron artist Ted Gurney is credited with later enhancing the design used on the P-47 cowls by adding a second set of yellow lightning bolts.
 
One can be pretty sure what the "A" stood for!
 
Cheers,
Bob
 

[image]local://upfiles/5932/9A05F1CE3488422D85425DE700558133.jpg[/image]

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Thanks again, Bob... you know, I saw a color picture of the 347th Jugs lined up on a runway, and the second one back LOOKED like it had a second, smaller set of lighting bolts outside the first, but it was hard to tell (adding to the confusion, the P-47 in the foreground had NO lightning bolts in the insignia, which I chalked up to unfinished business.)

EDIT: I just noticed "Laura Lee" (7C2) also had the double lightning bolt enhancement.

Major Hugh Dow one upped Maj. Raup by painting "SCREAMING RED ASS COMMANDER" accross his fuselage in large, red block letters, once again proving that subtlety should be sought somewhere outside of fighter squadrons!

Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

Hey Tom.
Yes that plane definitely made a statement.  My vote for the all time best aircraft nickname of WW2 - but I'm biased :) 
Cheers,
Bob

[image]local://upfiles/5932/7DC230B635D44DE9A67EE520D8861686.jpg[/image]

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I believe HDD is Maj. Hugh Dow's initials -- being squadron commander exempted you from the 7(letter)(number) scheme discussed elsewhere in this thread. It's good to be king!

Is everyone getting all these pictures from the 347th Pictoral and Historical book? I gotta get that book.

FYI I will probably add the pics in this thread to my 347th photo album on this site when I come back from vacation. If anyone has objections, go ahead and e-mail me and I will cease and desist.

A

Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group

The 31 st FG CO had his initials on there aircraft ,maybe they got it from them?
Did the CO of the 350 FG had his initials on his P-47?
Rick

ORIGINAL: 350th FG Remembered

Hey Tom.
Yes that plane definitely made a statement.  My vote for the all time best aircraft nickname of WW2 - but I'm biased :) 
Cheers,
Bob

[image]local://upfiles/5932/7DC230B635D44DE9A67EE520D8861686.jpg[/image]

Good photo Bob!
Rick

Hugh Dow on his aircraft "Screaming Red Ass Commander" and its eventual fate:

Looking back at it from a distance of almost sixty years now, it seems like the ultimate, customized, ego trip, war machine. But as time has revealed it apparently is a one of a kind paint job on a combat aircraft. At that time, December 44, I had just turned 22 and in one of my youthful excesses I either initiated or concurred in having both my enemy air (2 Me-109s) and my (3) ground strafing aircraft scores depicted together on the side of the Jug at the time we deciding on the paint scheme.

In a tightly knit group of men totally consumed with the same mission, where everyone knew what the scores represented, it seemed quite appropriate at the time. But, today, in the context of the larger world, (one that we all had yet to experience) this co-mingling of the two categories seems quite out of place to this same old warrior. Thus, while I do not mind sharing a rendition of this unique war bird on the Internet, in the interest of accuracy, I request that the depiction of my old Thunderbolt fighter be accompanied by this explanation when ever it is displayed on a Web page.

I was not flying my aircraft on the day I was shot down. However, the following day it was in-commission and was fully loaded with bombs, ammunition and a belly tank for operations. Unfortunately, it got no further than the runway, that day. Lt. Larry Wells, who I flew several missions with, blew a tire on "Screaming Red Ass Commander" during take-off and when it ran off the runway it shed its landing gear and ended up on its belly.

Fortunately, it did not burn and of course the bombs still had the arming wires inserted so they did not explode. Recently, I learned that the old machine did survive and was rebuilt to fly another day. An extract from his message reports: 1st Lt. Wayne H. Smith (347 Sq.) went down with 42-28961 (re- named Betty Jean at the time) on 3 Apr 45 following a dive bombing mission to Colorno. Statements in the report by the pilots Joseph Pickerel and Delbert Wylder indicate that Smith's parachute got caught on the tail when he tried to bail out. That was one of several 'double losses' suffered during strafing or dive bombing attacks. Shortly before his death, Smith had been overheard calling for his Flight Leader, Lt Norman K. Hubbard, to bail out! Hubbard was KIA, with Smith being the only eye witness-his call to Hubbard constituting the only information we have on what happened to him. Others on the ground who observed the crash could still be alive, of course. But, returning to 42-28961, like dozens of other 350th Jugs, the odds finally caught up with my old bird, unfortunately, taking young Smith down with it.

From http://warwingsart.com/350thFG/P47/347thFS/index.htm

Grandson of 1st Lt. Bernell A. "Barney" Forster (1921-2007)
347th Fighter Squadron/350th Fighter Group