Hey all,
    I'm making a model of my father's aircraft and would like help getting some of the details correct.

Name:     Betsy
Designator:    B-24D1-170-CO
Serial Number:    42-72956
5th Air Force, 90th  Bombardment Group (Jolly Rogers), 321st Bombardment Squadron (Bombs Away).

I've attached a photo of  Betsy.

I've attached a photo of my dad's crew (1st Lt. Sanfrid E. Odhner). This crew flew from June  to December of 1943.

The crew is mentioned in "MacArthur's Eagles" by Lex McAuley. He says they flew at least once in "8-Ball".

Were there other crews on  Betsy? Was Betsy's name changed? Did this crew fly other aircraft? So many questions! Any answers would be welcom.

I have found a decal kit for Betsy (1:72 Superscale 72024 B-24D/J) and am now looking for the best model kits. The decal kit says Betsy was a J, but that is probably a mistake -- it is probably a D?

I need to know about the nose turret -- what turret is it? Where was it installed, etc.

I also need to know what sort of gun turret was installed in the belly.

What are the best 1:72 model kits for this aircraft? I am willing to find and pay for old kits or premium kits,  and expect to have to mix and match parts from multiple kits.

Any details or photos of this aircraft (or the crew!), or where to find details/photos, would be appreciated.

Also any details of aircraft that might have been identical would be useful. Any info about the 90th B.G. Jolly Rogers in the second half of 1943 would be wonderful . . .

Thanks,
Justin

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Justin - FYI
Your Photo of " Betsy " is also in Book:
Log of the Liberators by Steve Birdsall  Page 187
Book: The Jolly Rogers , 90th BG History was
recently RE - Printed.
Saw copies on www.abebooks.com
www.aeroplanebooks.com
www.historicaviation.com
Mike

jollyrogerson

(
snip)
I have found a decal kit for Betsy (1:72 Superscale 72024 B-24D/J) and am now looking for the best model kits. The decal kit says Betsy was a J, but that is probably a mistake -- it is probably a D?

I need to know about the nose turret -- what turret is it? Where was it installed, etc.

I also need to know what sort of gun turret was installed in the belly.

(snip )

Any details or photos of this aircraft (or the crew!), or where to find details/photos, would be appreciated.

Justin,
Joe Baugher's detailed specifications for B-24D-1 are at this link; http://home.att.net/~jbaugher2/b24_9.html

Tony Strotman, MSgt (ret.), USAF
Son of T/Sgt Francis E. Strotman, Engineer-Gunner,
491st Bm Sq / 341st Bm Gp (M), Yangkai, China
"USAAF in CBI Tribute" http://www.usaaf-in-cbi.com

Mike,
    Thanks for the tip on "Log of the Liberators". I've just ordered a couple copies. I have a copy of "The Jolly Rogers, 90th Bombardment Group" on it's way already.

    I can't believe how fortunate my family is to have Betsy so prominent among the 19,000 B-24 aircraft that were flown. I wondor why she rates.

    I've also been looking into my mother's brother's service, and it turns out he was Communications Officer for the "Burma Bridge Busters" -- Capt. William P. Cole.

    Steven Spielberg did a documentary on the BBB because his father was a member -- in the communications group! I'm looking for a copy of that documentary now too!

Thanks,
--Justin

Hi Tony,
    It looks from Joe's info that Betsy was the sixth-to-last model D out of San Diego -- 42-72956, the last one being 42-72963.
    I am now working on the assumption that Betsy had a nose turret put on in the Pacific, probably much like Frivolous Sal's (picture attached).
    I am also thinking that she had a "Sperry ball turret similar to that mounted on the late B-17E" as per Joe's web page.

    Thanks,
--Justin

     

Attached Image(s)

Justin,

The photo of 'Betsy' in 'Log of the Liberators' is the same photo that you posted in your first message.  The caption in the book says that the nose turret on Betsy is a Consolidated tail turret.  You might try sending a PM to member Al Blue, he is listed in the 'Member List', he has a considerable background in B-24s and might have some information that can help you.   Also, just noticed that the caption with the picture of Betsy in Log of the Liberators says that the picture was taken in 'early 1944' which would have been after your father's crew had finished their missions on her.

Hal

jollyrogerson

   I've also been looking into my mother's brother's service, and it turns out he was Communications Officer for the "Burma Bridge Busters" -- Capt. William P. Cole.

   Steven Spielberg did a documentary on the BBB because his father was a member -- in the communications group! I'm looking for a copy of that documentary now too!

Documentary "The Burma Bridge Busters" available on DVD from History Channel.

An anecdotal history of Comm section thru 1944, compiled by John Garrison and edited by Arnold Spielberg in 1945, sectioned by timeline is included in book "Burma Bridge Busters" (Amazon.com).
 
Also, 341st Bm Grp portion of my website has some stories and photos submitted by veterans, 490th Bm Sq - "Burma Bridge Busters".

Tony Strotman, MSgt (ret.), USAF
Son of T/Sgt Francis E. Strotman, Engineer-Gunner,
491st Bm Sq / 341st Bm Gp (M), Yangkai, China
"USAAF in CBI Tribute" http://www.usaaf-in-cbi.com

Justin,

Betsy did indeed have the turret fitted in the Pacific.  Whether it was done at the Hawaiian Air Depot (HAD) or at 4 Air Depot in Townsville is unknown.  The nose turret was a modified A6A tail turret. 

No 90BG aircraft had ball turrets, they were all removed at the mod centre at Gen Kenneys order, and replaced with a pair of scarff ring mounted hand held .50cals  enclosed with a plexiglass dome.

You will also need to include the HAD tail bumper wheel mod fitted to all Pacific based B-24s.

Cheers

Pete

Attached Image(s)

"I have found a decal kit for Betsy (1:72 Superscale 72024 B-24D/J) and am now looking for the best model kits. The decal kit says Betsy was a J, but that is probably a mistake -- it is probably a D?"

Justin,   This sounds like a great project, and you do have a "classic" A/C with which to work along with being the son of a VET.  I have a piece of artwork based on the photo posted and had alarge poster of the same which has long since disappeared.  As for the comment on the variant ("J" as opposed to "D"), don't rely on the "packaging info" to always be historically correct (same with book "dust covers" and captions attached to photos).  "Betsy" is a "D" with the turret added (A-6A / A-6B possibly, but someone with more expertise will certainly jump in along with IDing the MOD site being the West Coast or Hawaii to clarify this).  Also as I scan the Site, especially in the area of modeling, I've found that some of the pics of B-24's built by "Oboyle" are fantastic!  I've seen his displays on other Sites and on Google. In fact, I remember seeing B-24D's in 'desert sand' lined up along a flight line which looked truly authentic.  I can't remember the place or if he had built all of them pictured (just an aside). He is great for giving leads, ideas and recommendations.  Personally, I have 4 Liberator models (all 1:72 scale and different variants) "in queue" awaiting my retirement.  At that point I will be in a "learning curve!"  Good luck! Good modeling and Best Regards!  Steven

Best Regards!
Steven P. Puhl
Willow Run Historian  (RET.)  
Home of 8685 Ford B-24 Liberators
Life Member: Yankee Air Museum

Justin,   Here's the link to "Oboyle's" thread with great info and pics dealing with B-24's!  also info on kits!  This will definitely help you!   Enjoy!   Best Regards!  Steven
http://forum.armyairforces.com/B24s-m128536.aspx

Best Regards!
Steven P. Puhl
Willow Run Historian  (RET.)  
Home of 8685 Ford B-24 Liberators
Life Member: Yankee Air Museum