Marcel Hogenhuis
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He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
Hello all, I am completely new on this forum and though my Heinkel He219 nightfighter research project seems not related to any USAAF subject, it actually is. Please let me explain why I would appreciate your: Before and after VE-Day many BG's, FG's and other units of the USAAF liberated German airfields, covered with numerous Luftwaffe wrecks including the target of my research: the He219. My request: I am looking for photo's, made by USAAF personel on the following airfields, on which possibly He219 can be seen. As was the case with RAF occupied airfields, such photo's could help me to find serial numbers and/or callsigns of He219 of which we would like to know their final fates: Nordholz (R-56), in 1945/1946 the 406th FG and 86th FG stayed here Münich-Riem: after July 1945, 357th FG, 70th Fighter Wing, 33rd FG were here Hildesheim (R-16), no units known Lechfeld (R-71), end 1945/1946 the 305th BG and 306th BG were here Linz-Hörsching (R-87), 1945: 17th BG and 79th FG were here Who knows of He219 nightfighters snapshots, made by any members of the units above, is invited to let me know on this message board or private mail address: marcelhogenhuis[at]gmail.com Many thanks in advance, Marcel Hogenhuis, Venlo, the Netherlands
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GREMLIN2
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Hi Marcel, RE: your search for AAF crew taken photos of Luftwaffe aircraft on Munich-Reims and Linz-Horsching airfields after hostilities. You might try doing a web search by topic and have website photos posted by USAAF Bomb Groups pop up. My dads crew landed at Reims and Linz in May and June,1945. There were a number of Luftwaffe aircraft around in varying conditions. Destroyed completely and partially,also untouched. Mostly fw-190's, Ju-88 types,109's, 262's,Stuka, etc. We had a topic on this website on some a/c photos at Linz but some of the photos are gone with the member. The 100th BG webpage has some photos you might try www.100thbg.com looking over for the He-219 type. Most of them at Munich were grouped in piles in one area. At Linz they were right along the runway in May,1945 some looking very airworthy. I attached a link to the Ralph Grover Crew at Reims near Munich with Luftwaffe ships in back of them http://www.100thbg.com/mainpages/crews/crews4/grover.htm Good Luck! Jack
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GREMLIN2
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Marcel, Do you have this pic? HE-219 photo In the National Archives collection,under War Theater # 12 Germany, CAPTURED MATERIAL Caption with photo read; "captured intact at Bindbach near Bayreuth by the U.S.Army, 11th Armored Divison" (No longer intact,being taken apart when this pic was taken) Jack
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Marcel Hogenhuis
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Hello Jack, Thanks for your welcome gesture in responding so quickly, I certainly will try the suggestions made! The Heinkel He219 at Bindlach/Bayreuth is well known to me, of the callsign, only the last part of it 'CL' can be distinguished and that seems to have been part of an operational callsign rather than the manufacturer code. I am convinced that on many attics in the USA, veterans (or their descendants) have old photographs on which such rare birds can be seen. It is just finding dedicated unit historians like you, to see whether they have been able to secure such pictures for future evaluation. Again, thank you for your support and the search goes on! All the best from a sunny Venlo, Marcel Hogenhuis
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GREMLIN2
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Hi Marcel, I'll check my collection of Luftwaffe airfield photos from after hostilities more closely for any possible ships your interested in. I'm always looking and adding to my dads crews history archive so your HE-219 type search adds to my knowledge. Check out my dads crew page link attached.I have a decent collection from Linz,Austria and the DP/POW Ferry flights as well as Munich.. I have an early May 1945 low 500 ft AAF recon photo of Reims that shows good detail of aircraft. One is an me-262 being run up on the ground with the dust from the exhausts leaving a large cloud behind it. The Germans were ordered to have their aircraft in groups,NOT being flown so probably an Allied advance team going through the a/c. (Finally don't leave out the U.S.ARMY combat units webpages in your search. Combat Engineers,Tank Groups,Infantry,etc. under captured German aircraft. A number of G.I.'s took photos of.) Jack
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GREMLIN2
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Freeman Field in the Summer of 1945 had all the best Axis aircraft. Don't remember seeing it on the newsreel footage from that time. Jack
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Marcel Hogenhuis
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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hello Jack Though this one is known to me, thank you for thinking with me. On www.10thbg.com (I wish all BG's had such extensive, well structured historical websites !) I found a particular aerial photograph of Münich-Riem A/F during the attack of 9th April 1945, a few weeks before US forces conquered that place. As it is still unclear to me whether a relict He219 was found there (in one book presumed to be a testbed for de-icing equipment), you might perhaps be able to dig up that aerial photograph and look for a bird with enclosed shape from above? Of course, I don't want you to do my 'home work' and/or a long search. So if it does not violate any copyright restrictions, would it be possible to send me a high resolution scan (marcelhogenhuis[at]gmail.com). The photo is the second one on page 6 (aerials of missions). It would exclusively be used for research, not for publication. Again thanks for your support, all the best, Marcel
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GREMLIN2
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Hi Marcel, I'm VERY familiar with that 9 April,1945 Munich-Reim strike photo. It's my photo in my collection captioned on the 100th BG website (courtesy of Jack O'Leary) It was taken from 22,000 feet and poor for ID'ing any aircraft types at the air drome. ( I think I bought it in a 100th BG photo lot on ebay from a seller in France. ) Since that's one of my dads combat missions I have spent sometime looking at that photo for Adolf Galland JV44's me-262's but very few aircraft are in the strike photo. Galland was away from Munich-Riems when the 100th BG went after the jets that day moving around to avoid destruction by the USAAF. When I get time after a holiday and return home I'll use the magnifying glass again for aircraft. Jack
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GREMLIN2
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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HE-219,Page 1...all image Hi Marcel, No luck yet finding any traces or photos of HE-219's at Munich-Reim or Linz-Horsching a/f yet.Still have more photos to look over with the magnifying glass so keep your fingers crossed. I attached a photo which looks like a HE-219 being shot down from 1944 in this AAF photo.(They had it ID'd incorrectly as a me-110) Can you confirm its a 219 ? Regards, Jack
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Marcel Hogenhuis
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Hello Jack, I have been away a while, just seeing your magnificent picture which shows indeed a Messerschmitt Bf110. I am sure about this because the long ends of the engine gondolas of a He219 would be very recognizable. Keep up the good work, perhaps among strafing pictures of Münster-Handorf (22 March 1945) or one of the airfields mentioned in my first posting, a He219 can be distinguished, one never knows! At the moment I am working my socks off, processing several 'new' flightlogs with He219 flights into my large database. All the best and again many thanks for your appreciated cooperation! Marcel
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GREMLIN2
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Hi Marcel, Thanks for your ID comments on the fighter's gun camera footage of the kill. I was wondering where you were since that post a month ago. Still looking through Bomb Group photos with nothing yet for you,more to search. If the HE-219's were there photos will turn up sooner or later. Fighter Group's gun camera footage striking the bases of interest is out there. I prefer looking for photo stills its easier. Another possible source would be the Recon AAF Group's flying low level photo recon. missions. Best Regards, Jack
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sonofatailgunner
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Hello Marcel, Sorry to veer off topic, (He219's), and I have no doubt that you have correctly identified the plane in the photo as a Messerschmitt Bf110. The wings and engines are very consistent with the Bf110. My question is: Why am I not seeing a fuselage or tail in this photo? It looks like the cockpit area ends just short of the trailing edge of the wing, and while there is some debris visible, I see no evidence of battle damage that would suggest the fuselage and tail had been 'blown off'. Although I know it's not possible, this looks for all the world like a flying wing type of aircraft. -Frank
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jtennet
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Frank, If you look carefully at the picture you can make out, amongst the smoke, the tail plane of the BF110. I think it is just the angle that seemingly shortens the image. Cheers, Jim
Jim Tennet (Curator and Chairman) Ridgewell Airfield Commemorative Association 381st Bomb Group Memorial Association. Life Time Member http://www.381st.com/
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jtennet
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Actually, I described that wrongly. The tailplane is seen superimposed over the image of the wing, just above the smoke. Definitely a 110 and, no, it hasn't broken up yet.
Jim Tennet (Curator and Chairman) Ridgewell Airfield Commemorative Association 381st Bomb Group Memorial Association. Life Time Member http://www.381st.com/
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shooshoobaby
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Marcel - There were 3 HE 219 Uhu Night Fighters recovered at Grove( Karup ) Airfield in Denmark. They were flown to Cherbourg and Loaded on Ship HMS Reaper. There is a Photo of one of them. They were marked USA 8 , 9 , and 10. They were later part of a display organized by General Spaatz 6/27/45. At least one of them was Flown in an Airshow at Freeman Field , USA 9/22/45. Book - Watson's Whizzers by Wolfgang Samuel Pages 143 , 146 , 166. The 54th Air Disarmament Squadron found several HE 219 Uhu Night Fighters at Lechfield. They were recovered , Fate unknown. Above Book , Page 91. Mike
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sonofatailgunner
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Thanks Jim, I can see it now. Between the camera angle and my declining vision, that was a tough perspective to sort out. Marcel, I searched Heinkel He219 in Google images, and amongst the scale models and artist renderings, found quite a few actual period photos of this aircraft in all manner of pose, and angles, in-flight, parked, crashed, etc. You may have seen them all before, but there often are links to other sites. Good luck -Frank
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GREMLIN2
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Hi Marcel, I'm just checking in to advise you I have no HE-219 photos of the ships at Munich or Linz in the AAF or veterans photos I have. Took awhile. I see no one else has found any yet in other AAF veterans collections. The display at the Air & Space Museum Annex at Dulles of one in pieces is interesting. photographer photos link http://www.flyian.net/aircraft/museum/nasmanx/he219.htm Keep Hunting! Best Regards, Jack
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GREMLIN2
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Re:He219's found by USAAF units before/after VE-Day
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Recent Freeman Field Recovery Team HE-219 post war color photo credit
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dennis_burke
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I think guys Marc is looking for very specific things and he will be well able to use google to find wiki and youtube resources himself. He is seeking photos that are not in the public domain and probably has a very good grasp of the types history well beyond wiki information.
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