First, thanks so much for replies to previous posts, it always strikes me how perfect strangers are willing to take time to answer questions.  I'll also continue to do the same when possible.  As an 18 year Army Vet (and counting), I hope to purpetuate the same sort of respect for my kids and beyond.....
 
Did B-24 crews train as a crew in Hawaii before moving to the PTO?  My uncle (1LT Robert F. Schmidt) served with the 372nd BS and trained with the 431st BS in Hawaii, but also appears to have been with some of the men he eventually flew with in theater.  His 431st aircraft was "Little Hiawatha" and I have a photo of him and his crew in front of it.  I think his eventual pilot, 1LT John Jacob in #877 Pregnant Polecat was also his pilot in training according to his log if it is the same guy.  He was lost 20 March '44 so most of the information I have has been patched together from some documents and photos I've found.
 
I appreciate any help,
 
Regards,
Paul Schmidt

My uncle flew with the 7th AF, 307th BG, 372nd BS and then was assigned to the 11th BG, 431st BS in May of 1943.  He was lost in January of '44.  From what I have seen the crews generally trained together and were then assigned together. 

What crew position did your uncle fill?  Where was he lost?  Do you have the MACR? 

- Patrick

Patrick,

Thanks so much for replying and it has been some time since my original post.  I have learned since then that my uncle Bob (1LT Robert Schmidt) was assigned to the 307th BG, 372nd BS following his completion of advanced fighter school.  He wanted to fly fighters, but there was a greater need for bomber pilots at that point so he became a B24 co-pilot.  Two squadrons of the 307th moved from Hawaii to the Solomons, but two others including the 372nd remained there to conduct search missions to defend against another Japanese attack.  Since COL Matheny and the 307th HQ were deployed forward, the Squadrons remaining in Hawaii were assigned as OPCON or under the operational control of the 11th BG, 431st BS, which is why a photo of Bob's crew there had the 431st stamp on the back of it. 

Bob's crew in Hawaii, Little Haiwatha, deployed to the Solomons in August of '43, but left the aircraft behind for the 11th BG, which was being reconstituted in B24s after previously flying B17s in theater.  The crew primarily flew #877 or Pregnant Polecat in the Solomons, but also other ships as needed. 

Bob went down on a B24 converted to C87 (Niquotina) off New Caledonia on return from leave in New Zealand 20 March 1944.  I do have the MACR and accident report as well as other records.  My email is paul.f.schmidt@us.army.mil if you want to compare more notes.  Thanks again,  Paul   

Paul,  Did your uncle fly out of the Liberal Army Airfield at Liberal Kansas during his multi engine training?  Or what Airfields might he have been stationed at?  We are trying to trace the route some of the B-24 crews took during their training.  I think Topeka Army Airfield was a B-24 staging base.  Thank you,  Phillip  in Kansas.

My father was in the 11 BGH from 1940, in my copy of "Grey Geese Calling" it seems to say that the B-24 came on to the Pacific Theater in January of 1944. The book states the first B-24 along with its crew landed on Santos on January 31, 1944. 

The 11th 42 Squadron lost their last 3 B-17s on February 1, 1943 along with their crews and a fourth B-17 from the 72 Squadron crash landed.

I am going to tell you I have been on this site for months and you have a very difficult time finding people who were in the Pacific Theater on bombers. They often went down over the Pacific and few planes and crews were rescued. 

We lost more planes than ships in the Pacific Theater. Have you contacted Phil Gudenschwager of the 11 BG H?   The 11 TH is having a reunion or did very recently.  Here is Phil's email address and know that his brother was on one of those last three B-17s that went down on February 1, 1943.

11bga@cox.net

This photo is from "Grey Geese Calling" and my father is in the front row with the helmet at his feet, it was taken in 1942 in the Pacific as they first Air Corp went after the Japanese

Attached Image(s)

Sincerely yours,
PA.Dutchman

Son of T/Sgt. Ray A. Heilman, JR.
11 TH Field Artillery 1937-1940
Schofield Barracks
7 TH AAC 11 BGH 42 Sq.1940-45
Hickam Survivor 12/7/1941
AAC Armorer (P) 911
P.U.Citation1942

Whenever you come to this site check out what happened on this day, it has this for today in the Pacific. You will see when the B-24s started their work and before 1943 the B-17s. This happened on this date in 1944. So they were using B-24s at this point and as I said earlier it sounds like they started using them in January of 1944.

Seventh AF Saipan-based B-24's bomb Iwo Jima and Pagan and hit shipping at Chichi Jima. B-25's from the Gilberts hit Ponape and B-24's from Kwajalein bomb Wotje.

Sincerely yours,
PA.Dutchman

Son of T/Sgt. Ray A. Heilman, JR.
11 TH Field Artillery 1937-1940
Schofield Barracks
7 TH AAC 11 BGH 42 Sq.1940-45
Hickam Survivor 12/7/1941
AAC Armorer (P) 911
P.U.Citation1942

Seventh Air Force Combined Air Component Command (CACC)

[As one of the four Numbered Air Forces in Pacific Air Forces (PACAF), Seventh Air Force (7 AF) has a distinguished heritage that is deeply rooted in the Pacific. Initially, 7 AF activated on 1 November 1940 as the Hawaiian Air Force. 
 
The fledgling 7 AF's involvement in World War II was best summed up by its air and ground views as "Just one damned island after another!" 7 AF fought the Japanese imperial might from Hawaii 2,000 miles southwest to the Gilberts, then 600 miles northwest to the Marshalls, 900 miles west to the Carolines, 600 miles northwest to the Marianas, 600 miles north to Iwo Jima, 1,000 miles west to Okinawa, always edging closer towards the center of Japanese power. A map story of the 7 AF would cover 3,000 miles north and south of Midway to Fiji, and 5,000 miles east and west from Pearl Harbor to the Ryukus.
 
The saga of the 7 AF's aerial exploits across the Central Pacific has the "rags-to-riches" qualities of a Horatio Alger story. First the almost complete decimation of the Hawaiian Air Force (predecessor of the 7 AF) at Pearl Harbor, then its gradual build-up and vast oceanic search missions to keep the enemy at bay. Later, long-range heavy bomber attacks softened up strategic islands for amphibious invasions, with greater weight brought against the enemy perimeter defense by the advance of fighter and medium bombers. Finally, after constant consolidation of gains, 7 AF smashed at Japan directly from both Iwo Jima, as escort to the long-range strategic B-29s, and from Okinawa with the Far East Air Forces in the rocky Ryukus, right up to the surrender of Japan.
 
The Seventh was the first air force to feel the enemy's weight and the first to take toll of the enemy. It flew longer to battle, used wider range of aircraft, and covered more territory than any land-based Air Force. It fought and bombed by day and night, flew distant reconnaissance missions, dropped every type of bomb and incendiary, sunk enemy shipping, mined enemy waters, and performed countless routine and special jobs. Its personnel served on isolated coral atolls, received scant recognition, and endured months of dreary monotony.
 
By necessity, 7 AF was a precision-bombing unit. Its commander, Major General Willis Hale, summed up 7 AF's contribution by saying: "The target had to be directly hit. The difference of 40 feet one way or the other meant that bombs would either land on the lagoon on one side of the island or the ocean on the other. And we didn't fly 2,000 miles to kill fish." 

This is me again now,
I was able to purchase a copy of "One Damned Island After Another" The Pacific Theater was NO cake walk, it was bad and worse but never good.

My Father told us how the rats ate their shoe laces out the first week in their tents in the jungle. Fevers and disease were so bad they ran out of room at the hospital tent. They then came to your own tent to treat the sick men. They seldom had a dry bed and hardly ever a hot meal. This was during June/July to November of 1942.

Attached Image(s)

Sincerely yours,
PA.Dutchman

Son of T/Sgt. Ray A. Heilman, JR.
11 TH Field Artillery 1937-1940
Schofield Barracks
7 TH AAC 11 BGH 42 Sq.1940-45
Hickam Survivor 12/7/1941
AAC Armorer (P) 911
P.U.Citation1942

PA.Dutchman


Whenever you come to this site check out what happened on this day, it has this for today in the Pacific. You will see when the B-24s started their work and before 1943 the B-17s. This happened on this date in 1944. So they were using B-24s at this point and as I said earlier it sounds like they started using them in January of 1944.

Per Army Air Forces Statistical Digest, World War II, Table 91, the number of B-24s in the Pacific first exceeded the number of B-17s in December 1942.  By December 1943, all B-17s had been withdrawn from the Pacific.

Removed from the Pacific Theater often meant shot down. The 11 BG H had 26 B-17s all were gone by Feb. 1, 1943.  The last three went down or were shot down on that date.

Without these great planes and even GREATER crews our victory in the Pacific would have taken longer.

I was able to help an Italian return a Lt. Roach's Brief Case  to the Roach family from a crash site during a bombing mission in 1944.

I have made contact with a number of families who loved ones served with my father in the 42 Sq. 11 BG H. The planes flew over thousands of miles of Pacific Ocean.

They have NO chance of receiving even a pencil from their loved ones when they went down.

It is no secret that the Pacific Theater did not receive what it needed until Europe was won. My father served in the Pacific from 1937 until 1945. He was at Hickman the day of the attack.

Both the families of those lost crews and my father continually agree on that one important issue. The Pacific had to do with whatever they could put together for 4 years before they finally received what they really needed to finish the job. 

Sincerely yours,
PA.Dutchman

Son of T/Sgt. Ray A. Heilman, JR.
11 TH Field Artillery 1937-1940
Schofield Barracks
7 TH AAC 11 BGH 42 Sq.1940-45
Hickam Survivor 12/7/1941
AAC Armorer (P) 911
P.U.Citation1942

As to the issue of when B24s first appeared in the Pacific; I only know what I've learned of my uncle's time with the 13th AF, 307th BG, 372nd BS.  He joined the squadron in Hawaii out of fighter school and I have a set of orders that assign him to that unit under the operational control of the 11th BG, 431st BS.  I have a picture of him next to a B24 with a 431st stamp on the back.  Also, several books I've found and other documents confirm that the established command relationship was because two squadron's from the 307th, in B24s, were to remain in Hawaii, while the other two moved forward to the Solomons late in '42 or early '43 (I would have to check the data to be exact).

Bob moved forward with his squadron in August of '43 and I have the aircraft record card for his ship that is dated that same month and year as to the delivery date to his unit.  

I've actually located some men that flew with Bob, but they are leaving us rapidly unfortunately.  I located a man who survived two B24 wrecks, one of which resulted in a month stay in the care of natives.  Amazing!  

Paul